Conlangery #09: Formality and Register

Conlangery #09: Formality and Register

Published: Mon, 01 Aug 2011 16:00:12 +0000 \

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Transcript

utterance-id1 <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> to the library but apart structured languages pre at georgia poorly chew my niece is beyond <unk> hello ah way up to the north was we have plenty of madison hello alright first of all actually i want to talk people's attention it'll be several weeks old by the time people get this but david peterson recently gave a an interview choose a sword and laser part gas at sorting laser number sixty eight i believe <unk> i think anybody interested in duluth rocky might wanna look at it it's not very technical at all what doesn't have much information about the language but yeah i think it's a very good interviewed has some interesting stuff about how it is working for a production company in with actors and stuff actually i'd love to hear the accurate <unk> i'd probably be a basket academically like florida speak to me it <unk> apparently apparently some actors refused to come back for a second interviews for um <unk> because they they they wanted to see how well they could speak and <unk> in non english and so they made them in <unk> on the spot which apparently some of them didn't care for that's actually a really high crime and when i was in college has to learn spanish passion of conversation thing and like our final project is actually if you still play in spanish which is fine and an easy but it's kind of five to maintain everything that you've land well also over lane that motion sure i can't do that and i just got a couple of awkward to talk to them for the skip by uh-huh yeah you've been hanging around with speakers in tongues [noise] uh no i can do that [laughter] that's a useful skills for <unk> [laughter] [noise] yeah well try doing it in front of a bunch of people <unk> no no [laughter] oh right anyway sally jumping to our topic sure yes yes all right well we're talking about today is formality and registers all languages have formal and informal registers and how that mark can read from some pragmatic conventions outside structures too full on morphological politeness systems like you see in korean or japanese so there's a huge broad number of ways you can show formality politeness the fact that you're talking to a different audience so we're just wanted to go over a few different ways that that occurs and natural languages and what options you have when you're looking at your <unk> when you want to try to realistically portray how people talk differently in different situations i mean there's a lot of definitely she can go with it and i think it depends on what you want it obviously i like steak fame nice like it depends [noise] for sure 'cause i mean in my face kinda thing i didn't add any formality direct traumatic i don't even think the second <unk> just a very direct people it seemed okay [laughter] and then with my second one i went the complete opposite direction added like <unk> like i believe <unk> um [noise] oh my <unk> on the second person kind of like spanish but instead of um [noise] tool you said it [noise] yeah and <unk> and <unk> [laughter] okay yeah yeah that does okay and oh my gosh oh sorry go ahead i said it and of course there's plenty of ways in between rather than the direct just making a pronoun there wasn't much there so [laughter] cut that out here will um <unk> it's really hard for me sometimes to think about all of these issues because you have to <unk> a whole bunch of things you can have it's like uh uh uh three or four way demonstrative pronoun system you have humidity on the part of the speaker which may be expressed or not potentially you may have respect for the person spoken to you may need to mark respect for the topic being address which may or may not be the same as the person you're talking to and you have to take into account your audience and and it's possible to be formal and mind boggling we rude or usually very in informal and still you know be polite and respectful and gosh every language picks their own group and gloves them together in frankly not very neat piles oh if i tried to speak korean i think my brain would just melt down and i would [laughter] i mean i would have to you know i would be a sociopath or near autistic and trying to speak korean because i would never know what <unk> level i'm supposed to be i can't even imagine clean i oh sorry um i mess up spanish all the time and just because i'm lazy and i just used to all the time don't care it to be honest it probably doesn't bother people <unk> it depends on the situation i'll tell you like ninety percent of the time uh situations i've been in april it doesn't matter but there are a couple of times that i get mad at and i noticed it now it's like crap [noise] uh yeah and the thing is the same formality thing something that seems like the same formality thing ah can have different meanings i have uh a little story to illustrate this okay we were talking earlier about second person pronouns and that's one of the very simple formality constructions you could have having <unk> familiar and formal or in in for one formal pronoun spanish has it in the form of two and listed and mandarin has it mandarin chinese in the form of <unk> and <unk> when i was learning chinese i was in china studying and uh we had an assignment to write a letter to our parents or i wrote to my mother and in in chinese and i wrote <unk> which is the informal you for and i thought that because in spanish he would use pool with your parents and my right ah bianca yeah yeah actually outcome and on this late i when i started out okay but then it came back to be it was corrected too <unk> which i don't think this is universal but it seems like some chinese think that you can use <unk> with your parents because you're supposed to be showing respect your elders okay that was my story yeah yeah and i think oh sorry go ahead i was just gonna quickly say persian i think that you would address your parents with uh not not with the informal from you'd you'd use the phone usually i mean that's why i think this is such a complicated thing to get at in both natural language <unk> because it's so <unk> to be able to use it properly you have to know the pragmatic <unk> you have to know <unk> how these things at what game and without that i mean you can make it best gas but you know what's right and one places have known out right now the place and like it makes that makes sense to me [noise] from what i know chinese culture you know jeeze i could actually say going either way tease the formula and <unk> their pants packed i think one of the things i found really odd i think he's informed on spanish when talking to god right see i think like i thought oh no you definitely use the full them all day that's true and older forms of english though that's where um yeah our referring to god comes from it but i was offered a million for me i'd be like yes it's definitely fun though and then in <unk> hill it's socially how these things i'd done in class if you want to add to it and you have <unk> any past the con culture to know how to add it [noise] so that's an interesting thing about using the the familiar pronoun was [noise] god we can think about the theology of that but it it reminds me of the situation of classical not watch the language of the the ethic empire um has too interesting tricks for marking formality the first one is it tends to do ah a funny <unk> verbs is it will take <unk> verb and it will make it either a cause addictive or an objective but then turn around and make it reflects of so you've added to syllables without really changing the meaning of the word because they've cancel each other out right when they come and see one removed um but now you got along the river which is really fun to read um the other thing that's really fascinating is being normal way of marking respect for people and people's things is to make them <unk> <unk> yeah <unk> <unk> west virginian accent that's respect the minute is respect yeah see you're blowing on line [laughter] yes [laughter] i mean people have tried to figure out what's going on there um it also adds an interesting interesting questions to the first pieces of reporting about the encounter of the spanish and the the ass tax because what might have come off as ups equally as might've been sarcasm [noise] right so there's <unk> there's all sorts of interesting questions just historically from from us realizing that and modern <unk> has the same sort of thing where you might have up to four different levels of formality in the language oh that's hilarious [laughter] now that i thought about it um [noise] <unk> hi <unk> oh i was gonna say um you said fairly enough i sell that um <unk> my games are longer 'cause i don't know it sure seems that way it seems that way but i don't have like a very big zero well think about uh the way english marks politeness and formality often say rather than saying uh definitely lots of water you say could you get me a glass of water say entertaining basically but slightly longer structure and with with uh slightly pulled back thing yeah like they should get a lot of health over like would you please do this for me [laughter] and i think you get the same type of thing and german along with the pronouns um spanish off at the same type of thing but you know these are all related languages and i don't really know that much outside of it [noise] yeah well for a long time formal chinese went the direction of brevity yes with lots of different pronouns to pick from when to to really just pick up the perfect level of ah things but i don't and and a modern formal written chinese sort of mixes and matches the sort of the classical language in modern but i don't know that's really good question um it seems like written language in chinese tends to be slightly refer because i will use classical terms that are one syllable rather than the whole use the spoken term which would be too so they work that two or three yeah [laughter] although this takes me to sort of another issue since we're in we're in the [noise] the sign no tibetan family the in the tibetan language they have a large parallels a cab you larry for all sorts of common items and actions which are used when speaking of someone for whom you have respect so my hand and my father's hand are different word [laughter] when there's a lot of his <unk> and i think i think job unease does the same thing i think this is not uncommon <unk> fairly reasonable but it also sounds like a pain in math to memorize yeah especially when like when you're studying then you want to say something and then they're like <unk> and you're like what's the difference 'cause you know a native speaker is gonna be like to see this one you're going to be like why i presume that uh children take a while to learn these i i would expect so actually i'm not sure well again i think this depends on pacman headaches i think you might be using that kind of thing more as a child [noise] because a lot of people would be you know <unk> even in japan kids get a free well they get off for a while because it does take a while to learn the rules don't win win which is supposed to be used for whom i mean just the japanese verbs for to give <unk> [laughter] yeah yeah and that kind of takes us and who you know the different ways to do it you talk about the parallel vocabulary japanese and korean have i beliefs different birds verb forms mainly their different <unk> and different pronoun forums yeah to the degree of the japanese ever uses them but yeah yeah although japanese pronouns are kind of opens set right <unk> and let's see you can drink now 'cause i'm talking to <unk> about chinese again but [laughter] [noise] yeah chinese has a little bit in written and spoken verses spoken for i know with just even like <unk> junction like and has four different words you that's what happens when you have two and a half millennia of literacy i think that's that's a that's a register more than a politeness matter yeah i think it can inflate it sell it usually that's right well that's the problem is is why i have a hard time thinking about this sometimes it's it's a formal issues this is a respect issue [noise] and with uh fairly it it's magnificent because it marks at least three of these potentially [laughter] <unk> yeah i mean for me i i consider them all the same i don't think i could separate them if i wanted to <unk> i often kind of try to figure out the motivation behind various politeness things like the way i figure through the the pro now in spanish versus chinese is i think of spanish being more about setting the emotional distance and us no family member wants to be called who says 'cause they're supposed to be close to you and the chinese being more about respect but i'm you know that's probably i gross over simplification of deal that's i mean for someone inventing a language that's to use verbal that's useful access to think about <unk> i mean plus than we have the whole <unk> the whole mhm phenomenon in australia of the mother-in-law registers now now now famous game yes right so if if you're in the presence of the opposite sex in law so if you're a man in the presence of your mother in law or woman <unk> your father in law [noise] there may be a slightly different way of speaking or in a few cases there may be an almost entirely different waves or the grammar is the same but the vocabulary of thousands of words may exist and then you have to use in the presence of <unk> not just of those relatives but a whole slew of of different relatives usually give the opposite sex so that adds yet another layer of difficulty right you need to speak informally but respectfully of your grandmother in front of your mother in law yeah i mean family seems to play a large part and that's just because well family family i guess [laughter] but you know in la family it's just different i think i complained about this last episode of now it's like we need a better word for in la [noise] when you're not actually married [noise] why don't you a lotta people will hold their significant others parrots mom and dad do don't you do that or i call them my <unk> mother [laughter] like just really confusing to people in like a mad and like now i think uh chinese i don't see them any last much as my parents what huh okay chinese uses terms <unk> basically to aunt and uncle yeah that would be weird but anyway pulling a little bit closer to the topic i think um [noise] what was i gonna say [laughter] good question um what about language is <unk> <unk> from l._a. because that happened english had pronouns <unk> obviously we don't use them anymore but we have other ways of marketing formality yeah people do that like if people do tend to think of english as a war informal language i think like uh or informal culture i think it might have to do more with things like writing verses speaking although you know you use more latin and french roots in writing couldn't speaking but otherwise they're very similar <unk> when you compare to say chinese has very different written in spokane registers as far as politeness is concerned i think the english system probably is about as complex as the bean it's maybe not as complex as korea budget [laughter] yeah we couldn't see a lot of the complexity in ninety two turning things into phrases <unk> little word choices rather than overt things like oh god i can't even conjugate the verb unless i know how <unk> i mean we don't do that [noise] i mean i <unk> go ahead oh i was gonna say i mean well there are ways to be <unk> english but even sell i feel like those are kind of going out of style 'cause god some people i work with couldn't be polite safe that lives um [laughter] oh another thing with english is the level of formality and the level of likeness seems to me to be reciprocal if someone is in this situation where they're speaking formerly the same structures will be used on either side regardless of like power or anything oh yeah hi oh sometimes language sometimes language will be used to sort of symbolically reverse the power structure it seems like i <unk> i should've said turn on the um when i was teaching i had a lot of students from different places and like yeah we tend to be mindful i'm aware that classes and then like <unk> like what three <unk> you know perhaps they're back i'm like no no definitely not that they're like <unk> now i just call me back they're like really and i'll say yeah i think you're older than me so i think <unk> fine [laughter] it's just a cultural thing as well so and like at the same time like i'd feel really weird if you know someone was calling me like <unk> like the mouse but um [noise] you know and then i just called that by their first name for me i'd be like i'm being a real dish bed right now [laughter] so i switched to the same type of right to stay certainly uh register switch the middle of a conversation can communicate a message well right now you go if if if you're with your you know some friends and this is harder to do in english but certainly i know i had a friend who experienced it in hindi [noise] i don't remember the situation but suddenly her friend switched to a very formal register and this was not because of the situation was formal but was because she was being scolded for acting <unk> oh yeah um i remember my sister and her husband taught in japan for a while and they learned a little bit of japanese and they told me that often times sort of an emotional distance thing go goes into the politeness system and there are times when someone who you wouldn't normally use only ah plain forms with if they switch to uh polite forms i believe uh that it was meaning that uh they weren't happy with you or <unk> they might be very very angry with you actually mhm [noise] yeah there's different things that sort of which can couldn't <unk> it can it can be rude or you know a little tease or it can be an indicator of something more significant like that there's just so many things you can do with uh the switch like that yeah there's some there are situations where you are deliberately rude for what reason or another kid that's the great thing about really languages with really obvious overt politeness and formalities it makes it so much easier to be rude without resorting to [laughter] to vulgar words [laughter] hi i think that's one of the lovely things about language and say you can get all the federal teams that i guess the author <unk> we'd have <unk> about how a stressful [laughter] but i had like the federal please <unk> you you asked earlier about if their languages in the process of of losing or are gaining formality i know that when i took japanese in college one of my instructors was unhappy with the formalities system in his language because he he thought it was he thought it was old fashioned but you're right you can't produce a correct sentence of japanese without [laughter] yeah i mean they can gain either is it just change into something else [laughter] and you know i can't imagine doing it every day i always say i do it in english but it's just not the fame i recall hearing and this is sort of have remembered so forgive me if i'm if i mess up on this but i [noise] whole reading that korea has one politeness or that has mostly died out but you will hear it in historical dramas and some people have taken it up to use on the internet yeah enemy kids [laughter] yeah i think that's kind of i i i bet amuses me that i'm entertained by that i liked that i proof that [noise] [noise] yeah i don't like it when people like try and bring something back like no this is the way it was it should be like this but i do like it when people like let's see this and just change it for something else <unk> re purpose though yeah yeah but but it's beyond was saying these things churn through time like the rest of language so even in english right are we don't normally in english just tell people to do things except kids and really close friends we we we do if uh uh we do a negative face strategy right we ask them questions [noise] could you hadn't read that book and if they're capable of that we're we're requesting that they actually do that and he's become so ingrained that this is how you make a command that you can use a question command once you get that out of here that all politeness which was the original motivation for that one was gone and that's how i guess people do things out that reminds me of a great site i feel like it kind of reminds me from a great story when i was teaching and i was actually going over to <unk> to be like where did you do <unk> helped me with my home like could you help me with my how much uh some other question and i think the last one i had been 'cause i'm <unk> like to help me with my home right now [laughter] [laughter] oh they were like the nice question <unk> and then at the end like you just have to come on and it just seems so rude like even to me i wouldn't say that without adding some sort of christ will it at the end of it right yeah um and i know somebody who again so that's one convention you don't do that and other things that we would think of is perfectly normal normal politeness like how often americans at least say thank you if you go to china and say shift you all the time i mean i know of one guy who got the nickname she has she has <unk> which means mr thank you because he said this all the time [laughter] yeah nope <unk> when i did uh pardon also happen to me in england well actually kind of their first i felt that english people are rude because it saves time instead of sanction like if you're not gonna bother to say the word all the way what's the point [laughter] oh i need to adjust to the culture bianca well isn't that just hit me [laughter] but it's the sort of culture of that that sort of politeness culture is kind of different because i notice with like ordering it restaurants or going to a shop there is not as much polite language going on to my year what <unk> what chinese uh like waiters and stuff not talking in like a noodle <unk> we'll say do you if you translate english that's sounds quite rude it's like what are you going to eat and things like that yeah and not even like i don't know like uh i got a better they today like if they said that to me while i was there i'd be like what the hell and i mean i don't think they should be in that polite but like i think i service industries like forced to have that stable register politeness [noise] mm that's interesting you weren't going to talk about we were talking about uh re purpose thing things you know made a note here about two voice and <unk> and so i like some spanish what purpose thing it is a bit i'm not sure how it came about and i'm not actually two formally <unk> myself now i got confused smelly and formal um but i was reading about it and apparently there is like a four way distinction insurance spanish way if you <unk> <unk> like the <unk> ah <unk> <unk> with the whole <unk> which is still pay on <unk> and then to con <unk> [laughter] which is you know pretty average and then <unk> you know they had formed plan which would be <unk> said that ends up being for different versions even now still only times like two and i was sad [noise] which i thought was interesting because i never picked up on it i don't really actually we don't get any trained t._v. so whatever [laughter] and it's an aspirin reversal because if i understood correctly boss actually historically was a horrible warm out west ah most <unk> west but i'm there's the <unk> well it might be a long time just like french is <unk> yeah <unk> <unk> <unk> forever now i think i don't know it's a shame we don't have <unk> [laughter] yeah he could he could uh correct any mistakes bonus yeah english is taught in the u. s. i think under plays the crate varieties of spanish available you mean like it's just time [laughter] yeah yeah i mean uh their english in the u._s. as well but [noise] i think they mostly teach sort of mexicans lasts a lump in spanish stay teacher pretty general south american but they don't teach and evil so i had to do like a presentation i did like a presentation on the <unk> which is actually a really good comic and of course they use <unk> [laughter] and i had to like go through the first couple of minutes explaining what the hell's will fly because even now these kids well my kids 'cause at at the same age as me and my class had been taking spanish for like seven years it never came up and i was just like really you know voice is not like the strange thing that only happens in like a limited area i was taught a little bit about balls and it's usage in argentina which i believe is uh where it's actually intermediary what between two and was there i i don't know about that i'd say it's slow way just because i'm not sure either i don't really know much about i <unk> but i think <unk> <unk> typically i <unk> i think at least that's what it's attributed to and then what i don't use ever even now much to the shame of my professors choice spanish i never even <unk> like i'm used to hearing it now just because they have some good movies i'm spain but god i'd never use any <unk> to me [laughter] someone i i'm sure someone has done a study trying to figure out what sort of substrate affects might be going on so that each region of [noise] south central america has their own way of doing these things might be might reflect practices of of no dying native languages so one of my my favorite ways of marking politeness all throat misery america um it's a very common to have a huge vocabulary of firms to describe posture [noise] and and and i forget i forget the language but there's one that refers to a human being sitting on the edge of a hammock swinging there [laughter] and apparently that's normally how <unk> the local bigwig makes decisions so to be respectful of that person every <unk> gets this past year over suffix with the implication [laughter] i was there and i had that too and now and i forgot completely crap so so that's ah you know that's that's an inch again you never know how this sort of politeness marking is gonna is gonna pop up apparently i think hindi or some indian language uses double cause addictive as a way to elevate the person you're speaking to the idea is that not only do they <unk> but they have so many servants that the servants others urban still do thing [laughter] you don't ask them to pass the sugar you have them cause them to be passed to you [noise] that sounds like a lot and i think there's a crowd and like so rich as servants to go to this like a place like seventh anyway uh that might be adjusts so story about how would double causes it comes to do this i might just be because you know it's longer and it sounds more thought go off my disney movie story okay ah i believe the i think the take away actually from a lot of this is there's just a whole lot of ways you can go when you are designing how to mark formality and politeness and you don't necessarily have to go with uh japanese style were forms or nothing you can do all sorts of you know it's a different side structure or you're using some <unk> a lot of times we're talking about structures letter re purpose from other parts of the language sure and don't they lazy like me and just add extra pronoun no that's a great system i like that it's a nice system but it's also that lacey system if it's it's not like if you if you come up with fifty of 'em [laughter] the <unk> <unk> yeah i will say my very first language <unk> had my original idea was worth free pro now and since they had sort of a military asks society eh <unk> had a pronoun referring to the guy who was above you could give you orders uh a guy who was your equal and the guy who you could give orders too sure i mean i think that's how it especially in classical chinese a lot of those <unk> or co opted to become pronouns that mean exactly that sort of exactly that sort of thing yeah and and i mean on the topic of register i have at least one language where i have a separate register just for poetry so certain grammatical structures are different there's a <unk> pretty substantial vocabulary alternate vocabulary available if it suits metro purposes [noise] actually either here use a different dialect <unk> 'cause i know i do yes i <unk> yeah i do i and i speak to my boyfriend family i have an english accent but if i had to like give a speech in front of them i use my mak an accent that's interesting people from maine have this really weird accent they put on the instant they start to tell a joke [laughter] i have not had it so yeah no the maniac <unk> it's pretty i had a roommate in college who just told the joke once i'm like what are you talking [noise] see i just have i can pick up different english dialects very quickly for some reason it doesn't happen with other non english languages but for my native language of english i can pick up other people's uh accents dialects fairly quickly so whatever i end up what if i live i if i stay in and english speaking country or different region for more than say a week i can get into that accent but it's uh it's like seventy involuntary i can't i can't i can't hardly sort of control it i can just like to bring back my american accent yeah that's kind of how it went for me uh now i'm better at separating that just 'cause i've been <unk> <unk> well uh shall we switch over <unk> over to feed her <unk> here yeah [laughter] i think we chill that topic [laughter] it's a it's a tough topic to talk about that all night but you know yeah four listeners you will be thankful for my editing because there's actually quite a bit that's base in there [laughter] to think wait what's the difference between [noise] yeah we have a good hour on that so [noise] [laughter] yeah so let's talk about our future <unk> which is pay on ah yes i'm paying nine me anytime capsules a web page yes ah was created by sally caseworker fantasy raised the terror in them a race of human woods with twelve fingers and twelve pose who live on the fictional ireland okay odd which periodically up here and then some merges in the black or caspian sea yes she wrote that granted she started this <unk> when she was a teenager you say i i forget when but she's pretty young when it first started yeah i think um i read somewhere that she was like a little girl when she actually started for the first part and she was <unk> thinking about it being a leg would or flying hats oh that's right yes yes yes the ideas so the idea did uh grow up a little bit so oh see i was looking at the picture now it's like a lot like the flying monkey <unk> if anyone to watch that kind of ten [noise] anyway [laughter] other flying cat i think is now that they're people symbol whites i worship apply cat or something that that makes more sense i'd wars with a flying cat to tell the truth looking at the the stuff it is very it is <unk> this is quite interesting there's quite a lot of interesting future's in it it's very sensitive to agency yeah sure i don't expect to find very often in a language that otherwise has vaguely european flavor mhm mhm like i was saying what when i looked at this i i was not expecting to to see a language that reminded me of dakota i mean it it does the language used to describe it or the the grammatical terms used describe it wouldn't match with dakota but it's basically what it is and the rest of the verb system a lot of really clever thinking about leyland scene and and other stuff is gone into there it's really hard to press anything out of this for me just because i paid from the nineties so badly organized it kills me yeah really i thought this compared to it's peers of the time that's true like <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> let's see i was twelve it yeah it's actually quite well organized actually it's <unk> the organizations not the problem the problem for me is the web web design but you know it's an old site when he called legs use these really old sites <unk> some people need to get on like square space or download or press on their server or something or you know just type it up and they're a nice p._b._s. rage you make it look good and i can be happy with tables and simple laughing [laughter] so this is before you're you're gloss crusade so we can on hold her responsible yes i was twelve i don't i'm not liking the like <unk> <unk> um so yeah i mean that's the other thing i was going to high up on that i play but it's already ninety eight of course she wasn't gonna put i. p. a. um sample would have been available yeah i mean that's one example is fine <unk> then [laughter] then uh yeah a lot of this uh i think that that she sort of describes things in terms of english a lot but yeah it's fun i mean it's all right i mean now that language he did <unk> <unk> oh so how do they <unk> but that wasn't really an issue yeah of course that one always <unk> uh that didn't bother me too much because it is a dramatic language uh has a lot of similarities with english birthplace so yeah it's a little bit more difficult because of the agency thing which i don't know it's kind of a minor <unk> these american languages i can pick up that <unk> 'cause i got stuck on the agency thing and for all we know she has some sort of her vision in the works and it'll make this better but i don't know i'd like maybe she died now that tell them that long ago alive okay good um we know this i think she gave a taco bell succeeded <unk> yeah yeah yeah she needs to update that yes i feel like there's a lot interesting going on hand like china pies from the sample sentences or english ones but oh i <unk> me to grasp on to it she has articles that are marked for agency yep <unk> participatory accused of an oblique engendered if that's in the definite article yes this i'll say oh go ahead i was gonna say the thing i was happy to final exam static versus active pronoun pronouns <unk> positions <unk> yeah yeah i was i was like i think that's my new kick i was really happy about that yeah this this is how i roll people but i i'm i'm searching through this thing as i'm recording and find new stuff she has <unk> classes uh [noise] i mean he's in a nice broken lincoln there [laughter] there's a lot of there's a few broken legs centre grammar i think she yeah that makes me sad because as much as i like a nice chart conjugation table i really want to know about syntax and that's what's missing your unfortunately there's plenty of examples of the language which helps um i would really love to see a slightly better presentation of a few text i mean otherwise i mean this is what we have is extremely thorough and well done and it's just like we had the comment a few weeks ago from someone you know what i'm saying a lot of you know something that's really worked out is is is worthy of a little more respect than simply a scotch and this definitely falls into that situation in my opinion i think this probably would benefit from the fact she's been working on it so long that you do get those little details or [noise] you know she just started a sketch not going to get [noise] um [noise] god like i don't want to complain about it so much because i think there's a lot more that offer and i just can't get to it because you know the organization is counting two days to me at least and the <unk> <unk> [laughter] yeah um if i had to guess i would guess that is one of the big hold overs from the early stages an english and ellen english speaker and sending their first language is when they're young yes produces things <unk> ooh [laughter] [laughter] yeah and then <unk> i don't buy my initial ruined his asian <unk> was not that great not very aesthetically pleasing [laughter] so yeah i mean i think if she would we do this she would change it i mean i would hope she would i mean having the h. in front of the thing in front of constant feed aspiration gosh i mean well it's <unk> actually <unk> well whatever it makes me want it to be like <unk> it's something that can like <unk> what's happening [noise] anyway i don't mind <unk> k. with <unk> voice [laughter] well it would be like <unk> k. and then k. would be you know evil i would be uh <unk> ration aspiration whatever anyway it's not important to the language but um yeah and i feel bad like complaining about these superficial things but i can't get past the surface i can't get into it and why you know [noise] yeah well it is oh i was gonna say i don't know why she created this language of this is mostly a person language she can smell it however she didn't want to please is [laughter] and then there's another issue i mean for those few people who've internalize their language pretty strongly <unk> why would you need to keep [noise] why don't you need to maintain a grammar you already know it or what happened i guess the point is to say but if you're going to say [noise] you know uh i would say as one of those people who <unk> really has has never really learned wonder if they're caught lying studied a great degree uh some grammar notes further your your own references pretty good idea but that that on line [noise] that's how i ended up learning like um <unk> if i need to be but that's ended how how is linda is actually going through writing the grandma just because i end up doing so many sample <unk> [laughter] that you know your entire life it [noise] yeah so i i'm on a hypothetical office forever [laughter] honestly that's heartbreaking game that i don't i don't blame you i i think more and more people ought to do gloss as if they can 'cause i i agree with you sometimes especially if you're just taking a quick look at something it is impossible to figure out the point being made especially this being i believe oh i see yes i mean to try and like the elements properly and see you know what's being an addict here and compassion each kind of driving me nuts the glove and it has both <unk> which also yes 'cause they had two little little confusion um i love how she so one of the things i always worry about when i start creating language is <unk> perception in particular perception i do on purpose and perception that happens to me so the difference between c. and look at you know here and listen to [noise] or we might do sort of middle sense that looks good that sounds good so that's yet another way for your verbs of perception to work and i love love seeing someone else who's laid this out former leave her <unk> which she does it by basically uh switching their conjugation class which made me happy i thought that was nifty because she's so sensitive to intention audi obviously see is something to do look at is intentional [noise] so that's nice well we're running a little long long time okay so this is less to talk about <unk> about how you should document you're like oh well at the time she couldn't have known but i feel like maybe she's just gone on to move to different projects i don't know maybe ship <unk> stopped caring but you know i think if she did want to visit and re presented as a lot of like he could do to make it more accessible yeah but the language itself is fairly well developed <unk> i think that's why i'm getting a night it because i feel like there's something that i just can't <unk> because they don't have the focus [noise] to read through this may be one of us should uh help her update her website [laughter] and put her grammar stuff that she has into uh different format but we're running a little long but i really really want to get too far feedback for today because i really wanted to acknowledge these if you all are pretty much done with talking about paying uh yeah you'd probably say more but we should [noise] yeah i'm just going to be hyping on the same thing yeah but um we've got a comment on number four from the handle uses <unk> crime lip ah says thanks for the review of <unk> as you will have gathered i'm an amateur with no formal linguistics training has lay out of the grammar although as you correctly surmise it's more written from the point of view of the cat is lower learner rather than they linguistics expert it also has its tongue in cheek is is it occasionally heads i shall i am currently at work i don't know much revise edition of the dictionary afterwards the next job is rewriting grammar i will definitely be taking your comments into account i'm <unk> glad that you both agreed that <unk> has a phone character and field and then from desmond on number five as the inventor of the <unk> uh i feel very honor that my language this <unk> this discussed this this week on the collect <unk> i guess i simply can't wait to listen to it first thing to do when i get back home this evening which presumably he did but that's what a <unk> what's ever again [laughter] nice to rang yeah yeah yeah it's not like we're pretty nice too it's not likely caroline turkey <unk> yeah yeah um if the inveterate <unk> listen to her so she probably doesn't want to talk to us but uh [laughter] i don't wanna talk to <unk> [noise] but um i thought it was i wanted to read those two emails because i thought it was really great that those guys got back to us and and talk about it and uh to the <unk> i say uh thank you for you know taking our comments into account but um i i will say as much as we had little mid picky things to talk about with that language i thought it was very well done yes and hopefully in this new one he'll put send me now how the farms arrived that was the one thing i was most interested to see yeah some history would do well so do either of you to have you done anything different with your with your differently with your language is since we started doing this broadcast i actually started creating too uh languages for my novel and i used awkward i oh i started a new language and i'm going to do uh <unk> the last one that was really happy with um <unk> i don't remember what it's called i'm still recorded by the way so [laughter] no i i wanted this recorded i thought the <unk> um well last time the one with the guy in utah [laughter] that would be <unk> yes that's what i have some that which i guess it's also i have some the native languages somewhere but yeah [noise] yeah the only thing i did was created some different um in a one language i'm working on now got a few more family words than i normally would get this early and yes we yeah that's that's something i thinking about my old my older my existing languages family terminology would get really weird because of different things but that languages i'm working on now i just have started yourself phonology sketch and a bunch of randomly generated words but um i think i probably will do a lot of thinking about uh can ship terminology now probably a lot more thinking about morality that either [laughter] [noise] oh is that <unk> people listening should let us know if if we've motivated you to do something different yeah yeah yeah that's a very good thing email con language email dot com or leave a comment on this uh on the show notes for this ah episode if you have any changes to your language <unk> mate that's a good idea indian alright glasses so we are over an hour with this episode at least on the recording so i think we can wrap it up now yes happy <unk> cow thank you for listening to con lying or you could find all our episodes and show notes as well as subscribed to r. i. too or are assess speeds through con larry dot <unk> dot org you can also like our face book page or follow at con library on porter if you would like to contact us with corrections comets questions or suggestions or even suggest your own caught lying is a future please a male <unk> uh gee male dot com or call in to our new voicemail lard three zero four eight seven three six to eight one we also have a handy suggestions or on our side pardon me read it in my <unk> mm mm mm mm mm

Tags

  1. Conlangery Podcast
  2. Podcast
  3. conlang
  4. formality
  5. language
  6. linguistics
  7. politeness
  8. register
  9. Teonaht

Conlangery Podcast/Conlangery 09 Formality and Register (last edited 2017-09-06 00:01:26 by TranscriBot)