Conlangery #16: Tense

Conlangery #16: Tense

Published: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 09:00:19 +0000 \

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Transcript

utterance-id1 <unk> <unk> my flight that came on double my [noise] [noise] [noise] [noise] [noise] well to park the luxuries apart <unk> truck did languages people's create george carlin is lovely <unk> hello ah the great state of bush's cause we have william <unk> hello ah we have a special yesterday from all the way in spain hi your name and tell us a little bit about yourself <unk> <unk> well i'm spanish so we won't have to think whoa whoa board was this in spanish i wished <unk> who was here like except for except one uh i have lived in belgium fourteen years so i know french and i can't speak it fluently and i am just trying to study japanese but i'm just starting so don't expect me to know many things but you said you're from the very beginning <unk> or [noise] yes i have a very very beginning call on her i i found out about about <unk> uh uh for a month ago when this pop distorted [laughter] yeah well it's nice to have yard hi amy thank you you should say why you discovered congregate because as much as i would like to think that this <unk> cats did it [laughter] [laughter] i was looking in the <unk> and i i discovered that with rocky was <unk> the language i flipped out i was like whoa you can do that you can create languages i wanted to do this and that directed me to the t._v. and i found the past which i have they always into san <unk> one and i love it [laughter] see that's what we want to here yeah [laughter] well let's see a lot of us just lost our [laughter] well uh i hope this episode is up to your standards [laughter] ah how about we just drive into our main topic today uh we're talking about pets and aspect this is going to be part of a two part series we're going we're going to do that's an aspect on this <unk> this week and then next week work on the cover boot [noise] but um basically these three things are three things that are very commonly mark on verbs and they all are sort of tangential to related nuts you have to kind of pick them apart especially pets aspect it's like both deal with sort of pepperell things so pets you have <unk> at most basic past president future and it's just the time it which something occurs in that aspect it's more about things like duration and and whether something is continued or something just completed and uh i'll throw it to you will [laughter] you could probably have started it better than i [laughter] yeah you you sort of covered it <unk> it was kind of hard for us to decide in planning this how to break it up 'cause mood can be so complex and aspect is pretty complex we started off saying oh tennis is easy we can cover that in five or ten minutes [noise] a little more complicated than that but [laughter] but uh i i think we it's it's easy to just easiest to discuss tension aspects together and then move onto mood [noise] with the warning that the three of them are hopelessly muddled yeah i think it's easier to get taxed aspect <unk> yes yeah yeah because they are <unk> many in many times merge together yeah he i can ask about the pets and i'm <unk> [laughter] you can i have students preparing for like three days [laughter] that's good so i don't know actually george the simplest ten systems are passed in non pastor yeah i'll just go either way you can either have passed a non past or future non future [noise] yeah although from what i understand past non past is much much more calm right ah i think how i'm sure when that actually i could understand that i mean there there are some yeah there are many languages that like march future and present mhm [noise] i don't know i'm dating just yeah nice meal for [noise] [noise] yeah my guess is one thing i've noticed that even languages that er aspect obsessed and don't mark tense much might still have future marking ah this which is why i think you might get a future non future more likely to be you know written down on that type apology chart does exist in languages that or otherwise mostly aspect obsessed now here i wanted to ask you about something william is uh you specifically said that you don't like certain things that a lot of people learn in linguistics classes they say that uh english actually has passed non past rather than past president future even though traditional grammar states that we have a future <unk> right well that's not what i i object to obviously a lot of english grammar only cares about past non past [noise] right i'm going to the store tomorrow would i object to is people saying the english has no future at all just because it's <unk> okay east on will explode in a few billion years is a simple statement of the future [noise] is not a mood [noise] yeah he's the simple statement of the future [noise] the thing granted the future <unk> go ahead bianca oh yuck i don't really say anything i like moving stop moving [laughter] i think it might be kind of a future yeah the future is the moody as to the ten says necessarily we don't know what's happening in the future so it's there's no way around a little bit of weirdness uncertainty around it [noise] and and for example the latin future developed out of what was the sub jumped in you know agree can sanskrit [noise] so there's no doubt to the future is weird [laughter] [noise] um it is it is weird um but that doesn't mean necessarily for example of english doesn't actually have a future but that's the only thing i object to yeah i think mostly when people are saying that they might be hurting something but i think the way it was explained to me in linguistics classes is <unk> english doesn't really have a <unk> morphological future tests right which is boring yeah yeah true but obvious yeah but it will although at has other meanings <unk> <unk> it is used to just fate simple future cats but it's just yeah not always there [laughter] [noise] so i'm just looking at my list here of interesting things to say about ten <unk> so and oh sorry go ahead no go ahead okay an interesting thing and when you compare english and spanish and english their main anyways books for a future going to uh pressing continuous anything and spanish there's like <unk> so when you're in english class in spain you have to learn all the weird uh peter <unk> <unk> and what they're used for and you have passed so great and everything yeah right what spanish has morphological future right yeah with with uh an actual <unk> and it has the <unk> iraq right oh yeah <unk> that's the only ones that i learned to do <unk> i think i think that's about the only one they've got one of the few <unk> futures that we have it's not really extend that like in english and that's mainly for just near it it's literally just going to end it has basically the same thing yeah it it's literally the same <unk> yeah it's pretty much a packer fan um so how can i say oh i had a question hi [noise] um [noise] when you say the <unk> teaching english um <unk> now not oh last into different futures and then like when you use pressing <unk> when you isn't going to <unk> well and because i can't remember right now but there are <unk> i remember from my from my english class there are many [noise] name you tend to future in english and you have to and you use then each for for a for a different situation for example times tables you wouldn't use person simple for things you have a range with another person you spurs and continues etcetera etcetera and spanish like oh are we going you mean like yeah okay i understand i had something in congress and i think like you had to deal with [noise] happened to me with three dish yeah they have if you're like wait j._f._k. distinguish uh <unk> <unk> <unk> and <unk> well naturally and like well rain five fish well it's not the same in english i don't think i am going to the <unk> kinda like going to the <unk> and but the rain you can't make it rain [noise] did you have anything like that i had uh you can go ahead george oh no you <unk> ads for her question and i'll get to okay ah <unk> and tension [noise] let me think actually what i remember doing eh when it was i going to say uh i forgot again well uh while you're only emily millions and millions of american high school students who are tortured <unk> jump to will be happy to know that spanish students have trouble with some part of english grammar and i had it on line conjugate uh um i know uh i will explain myself i have to be in belgium fourteen years they it's like the thirty year old english there and it's my thirteen so my english is that the <unk> [laughter] well i mean after a certain point like react because now at but we don't consciously now [noise] but anyway the point now he's getting at i was just curious as to your perspective plan ice skating is that you know what the future you still have stepped up my emails like intentions i says unintentionally how i read it i don't know if that's how it actually is i think in the initial roses and intentional i i can't remember something like for example we were told that you had to use i will open the door for example if you made a deposition on the spot like <unk> i'll go open the door but if you had planned it beforehand you more likely is going to or for example when you're making predictions you would use [noise] going to like it's going to <unk> if you see they fickle proof for example the skies completely gray but if you say it'll rain it's not that you've seen physical broken steps you just think it [noise] oh yeah <unk> those are really complicated i remember i've had i had some friends from hong kong but one of them now cantonese i don't know much about but i i i'm guessing that like <unk> it doesn't really have much in the way up tent but anyway she would say things like will you go to mountain liar witch mountain liars the student union that our university and when she meant more like are you going to whereas now so there was sort of a pragmatic difference between the two ways of expressing a future of it but she wasn't understanding precisely anyway at william you were going to get to um i was going to add two things i believe that overt marking of intentional versus unintentional intentional versus you know predict of future [noise] it was pretty normal for example the to get to <unk> not be distinguishes an intentional future [noise] um but there's also a hint of different um distances into the future so we've just been so far talking about past president future where we only point out times that are not now whereas it's pretty common in languages on this planet to have different degrees of past and different degrees of future [noise] um one thing we can say pretty strongly you type apology is that you're always going to have an equal number or fewer distinctions of the future than you are going to have in the past and that makes sense right there's less you can say conclusively about the future [noise] so you might have uh uh uh kind of clothes pass and then and everything else passed in some languages and i've <unk> the maximum obscene is five different layers of past tense is [laughter] cuts in panic whereas you know the last few hours not unless yours but part of today within you know not for today and then you know a remote past it's only use for for stories or or things that happened outside your lifetime so yeah i think <unk> are good for my <unk> past had like you know get kind of just happened past and then you get typical passed which is you know from alex you're like a couple weeks and then they spend past which are in a while back [noise] do you remember how many futures had had <unk> yeah yeah that that's that that's a normal balance yeah i <unk> oh sorry go ahead go ahead now okay i <unk> i went crazy with like <unk> and i did that me er er er near past uh sour past and then uh a <unk> i think to indicate an unknown time in the past but in the future i it's like <unk> <unk> to to indicate different levels or a sufficient and production and things like that so i guess that's contradicting what william just said <unk> but <unk> that could or april teachers that could actually get a little bit into mood yeah that's how like you're if you're talking about some position and such that that'll that'll get into mood territory um have any of you guys used or heard about a lot in that lying about actually i'd be interested in knowing if there are <unk> have this saw that have relative past relative future um i was just wanting to bring that up right there is this is why i realized after i'd set it saying oh tense as easy as complicated 'cause then you have to deal with the question of tense relatives now tense relative to the situation you're describing mhm [noise] and that can get complicated um i was going to say i mean english obviously has relative ways to mark relative <unk> um most languages do sometimes the whole language uses relative ten so that if you're telling a story you know that passed in the future relate to the time the story and an english is one key and and marks relative tense differently [noise] yeah actually that's that's that's interesting that you bring up stories because and the <unk> i'm working on right now i rio um i originally had at doing just like a universal types and then relative future and relative pass and i found it was murder <unk> difficult to write a narrative and so i changed it too it's just straight up past president future but it's still the odd things with narratives like it the narrative <unk> to a present tense but then relative to the time of the narrative the changes that yeah i would almost be inclined to say that's relative tense but then i'd i'd want instead of narratives i just want you know someone explaining [noise] say a story about how are you are running to catch a a bus and and twisted your ankle [laughter] [noise] [noise] but um okay if i ever asked okay back to to take a lot [laughter] i like the idea of having at least here defined past [noise] um and <unk> just because she now when i say it could have been you know happened now they could've been could've stayed in five years ago i'm not really highly meal and it happened the other day so you know i like having to hide it in that oh yeah there's <unk> there's an interesting thing is spanish uh that i wanted to talk about which is in spanish uh we there's two there's two ten says that are almost interchangeable uh which are being that simple or preston perfect simple and present perfect compound and grandpa of whatever i just signed now uh <unk> uh i i they may be cold differently in different textbooks but pressing perfect simple if uh you're each day and arresting perfect compound <unk> <unk> <unk> it so okay so uh i uh the the present perfect compound is is used only in spain except for the [noise] except for a gallon <unk> only um where they use the the present perfect simple just to just say the same and and the regions that use pressing perfect compound uh there is a difference between present perfect compound which relates to uh more uh recent past wait oh crap i have been referring to the press and all the way sorry it's passed it spreads right i i got my writing crossed okay okay well i'm talking about is actually i don't remember having a <unk> not a professor teacher from spain and that present perfect is what i <unk> watch for different and south america yeah go ahead [laughter] say no because i am you have to tell you staying in south america yeah in south america i read about that in south america and uh that pressing perfect s. like pressing perfection perfect and english meaning you had that experience yeah if you use it more <unk> uh it's more like do you do it when did you do it uh and things like that i read about that it's it's it's one thing um i know in my <unk> stuff that goes around at the perfect english and not actually you've uh makes efforts to two different time period [noise] specially <unk> i think it ends up being three in the past and i kept a song someone it's more like <unk> <unk> sold my book that had the information and <unk> look it up [laughter] well i always thought that uh i was thinking that uh president perfect and english actually had an aspect roll distinction like uh i have done something refer would be like a perfect if it would refer to i completed action um yeah i think so i'm not <unk> or i'm not sure about the aspect pot but i do now that <unk> an extra point in time and just simple past [noise] i think yeah from <unk> yeah <unk> what what gets called the perfect in english is a pretty complicated thing which i was hoping known who's going to bring up because it does a bunch of different jobs one of which i would consider purely aspect tool and then others that are tends [noise] so this experiential sense that was mentioned earlier that seems to be more aspects thing like have you ever eaten badger [laughter] yes that's right that our english teacher told us that that the simple past with more too too fat and then the [noise] the <unk> the present perfect related more to have you had that experience so or it's more like <unk> talking about uh experience and she explained it uh have you have this experience and your whole life right <unk> ever and things like that yeah the the point of the perfect in english is that it has an effect that extends to the present uh for it's between d. f shut the door and have you shut the door and that's where this sense of of um experience it makes sense for that sense to get gummed into that because obviously once you've experienced something that remains true for the rest of your life [noise] <unk> yeah although um [noise] and i i i understand that the that <unk> that usage sort of <unk> differs between dialects particularly between the u._s. and britain but i'm not sure on the different one thing i'm thinking of the past perfect in english as a totally different thing isn't that yeah in narratives a kitten note past that's further back from the past past tense narrative which is right and then it is sometimes called an interior past yeah [laughter] freaked out like a day ten synthesize many trailer [laughter] maybe the whole topic [laughter] right in fact we have talk for about thirty minutes about [laughter] [noise] that's quite complicated <unk> think about it um 'cause you can't i mean you can always say oh this <unk> <unk> <unk> well that's a lot in life that can be going on that mhm [noise] so george why don't you just edit and go back and they were just talking about tens today [laughter] do reflect the federally china combine all three and not have our heads explode no i mean that really [laughter] but let's skip tent let's skip aspect and and stick with pets okay well let's yeah do we have any more stuff to talk about with pets i mean yeah what about like progressive non for graphic <unk> those are asked let's let's see [laughter] that that out [laughter] she will [laughter] so <unk> if i only allowed in episodes thirteen right [laughter] so we've been talking so far about tense as it relates obviously the verbs [noise] would you can also attach tends to not homes and languages [noise] yes sir english we have um things like the suffix to be like the bride to be um and that indicates future but it's a little bit specialized [noise] we have the <unk> ex ex wife right going from right to be ex wife um but there are some languages where the you know a tense marker that goes on to verbs can also be equally well slammed onto a noun my favorites are called <unk> um which are used indicate usually that someone's dead [laughter] oh so for example though the wash show language from from north america has um [noise] uh uh <unk> which is sort of uh tense combined with aspect [noise] so you can either use it like a tense <unk> which meant you know it was raining but it stopped or you can smack it onto known my little o._u. which means my deceased parents they went living but now they were not but now they're [noise] you know uh uh tusk aurora which is what is it really it's really the mohawk which probably more people have heard of um has the same suffix but it can either indicate that someone is deceased or that they are no longer fulfilling a particular role ah either mean my ex wife because we're divorced or my ex wife because she has died huh so it gives a whole new meaning to the the phrase speaking of someone in the past that right [laughter] right [laughter] so they are and it's an interesting thing into the niece for example you can't uh <unk> uh uh uh <unk> tense a marking so me i mean you can't speak of an active in the past marking bass for example if you go to let's say concert and someone asked you about that concert you can say it was interesting unless you've got that and because the interesting uh base or is almost <unk> so you add the cat to mark eh yeah that's interesting is that i know it's a japanese has like two different types of adjectives and one of them it <unk> more like in terms of that right is that i <unk> yeah they're <unk> i <unk> and nah i <unk> yeah they conjugate differently for example you can't do you can't quite do the [noise] the cat ah thing on the magic to us because you have to inflict the second part the desk part mhm so low <unk> for example let's say it was it was famous instead of saying pressing would be you may not us but past would be you may not <unk> yeah yeah so <unk> inflicting the death part the latter part so without making it too much about japanese it you you know if you had a language where you had adjectives in general or a class of adjectives that behaves a lot like <unk> you could you could add tense onto that that's an interesting idea too yeah actually they they all say like <unk> and they got to just like herbs and say something was not interesting or not famous [laughter] i like the objective yeah the um [noise] take another look it took about one weird thing that relates to mood <unk> well [noise] and then and then we'll have have gotten through gone through my entire list of things they wanted to say about ten [noise] um it is common across lots of different languages [noise] to create the comforter factor <unk> mood my combining the past and future marking i would have gone oh english does this um uh <unk> that's the same thing and i don't have an example handy so i won't produce one on the spot [noise] um but it can vines uh <unk> it's two different kinds of futures are both possibly be combined with this kind of <unk> of past you productive uh practical thing to to to indicate the color of factual huh so when you when you're getting it's kind of a mood thing but because it's market with tense i thought it it it seemed worthwhile to bring up here [noise] and actually it is it is definitely a mood saying but yeah i never thought of wood quite that way even though i knew would is past tense of will i just didn't really think of that's kind of <unk> crazy it is a little bit crazy to seen english is not i mean would is not yeah what is complicated boat if there's like a whole store called past that's a <unk> or something [noise] um yes it feels somewhat weird to to research with s. uh past uh well because we'll s. future yeah means teacher so it's kind of future that <unk> [laughter] well [noise] [noise] [noise] [noise] what someone's getting a phone call and i went to the phone call i mean to you later ah land anyway [laughter] i can edit that up why don't we move on to talking about cleaning off and we could i could i say something about and that relates to aspect but also the towns short yeah in spanish and and and and french too there is an easy way to to differentiate before between perfected any perfected meaning ah whether or an action is don when you're talking about it or not so that it would be if if the verb is in a simple pen and perfected except for the credit right uh perfect uh simple perfect which has perfected stuff in town sample at all [laughter] are you <unk> if you ever have only one word for it and perfected unless it's asked certain towns which is perfect it you're happy about predator again and perfected right yeah yeah well <unk> to this day and then i think we kind of i want to say this uh we kinda paid lip service is a little earlier but you can have a language that just doesn't have pets at all which is uh like like the norm in chinese as it does actually have a way of marking future that analogous with will but in general it just doesn't have pets and did i say this already that that even languages that don't usually march tense might still have something future like yeah you you mentioned that and that's sort of reiterating nuts because you know you like chinese those that i know some chinese <unk> <unk> [noise] anyway why don't we move on to play on now um [noise] i know this is another language that uh bianca doesn't like [laughter] i think you have a point on that fun [laughter] [laughter] well um let's go into the back background playing on was created by <unk> <unk> it was um i think other people had created phrases off with but i believe he created it he was he was hired mainly first star trek three at first right i think that's right yeah and um [noise] the <unk> the main thing you have to remember looking you're planning on is he was asked to do a very hard and very alien language and with with that he made something deliberately crazy and bizarre and as backwards and tired of it [laughter] uh so the like <unk> [laughter] sorry but i it is like the first thing i noticed when i started looking at playing on his i found that caused the chart and normally in a <unk> you know a lot of <unk> you can find like the series but <unk> but the uh and all but it's there's there's a little bit of the there's at least some level of similar tree and in the first few lines of that and playing on it looks like he took the costs the chart and threw it through dark side [laughter] it's more like for the outside so he can get a nice <unk> around [laughter] typical <unk> do you have [noise] um let's just say yes and you don't even have like an <unk> i'm disappointed [laughter] you're you're annoyed that it happens not to have one strange that i don't know what at this point it might as well [laughter] no it could so i've read his dissertation on the <unk> language he could have gone with um quite stranger sounds than he did he was very restrained he <unk> easily have gone the direction of making clean um the first language to make each active confidence popular instead of not be he could very easily have done that but did not have awesome awesome [laughter] they are awesome but <unk> it's it's [noise] the church is weird but it's not because he has an enormous number of strange sounds they're only a few of weird because it's very coherent between found <unk> it's not weird because the towns are any really particularly strange there are some that are very difficult at least uh for us english speakers to say like the the you've dealer africa and such us but they're they're not that strange there there are things that you could reasonably teach an actor to say if you have a really good speech but um like they didn't [laughter] well it's but the problem with the the issue with the phonology is is it has all these gigantic whole town and not <unk> i mean bush i mean a little bit of <unk> training found pictures you know i mean you don't have to have the complete ferry fine i don't we don't want to spend the whole time talking about the <unk> <unk> what can i talk about it we should talk about how to not the same mistake [laughter] i mean i think it was deliberate but he did that i don't like the best idea for him out he cut his <unk> without making stupid [laughter] now that we are talking about confidence i want to add uh one thing and the cleaning language as to what age there is a banner on the top that changes that shows a different race and whenever you're refreshing page one of those phrases is peak forcefully and uh well it says that if you are projectiles peer thing over and your your partner wild <unk> you're doing it right this is this is something that says this is just something that uh the the people who teach people calling on uh say is this has to be spoken forcefully but i think it's more so that you get the cross playing on voice to it rather than anything particular in the language but yeah [noise] well no it really is it's it's in the grammar as well but <unk> you know [laughter] you might you might <unk> that strongly <unk> um aspirin constant you might <unk> little spit clean guns to not worry much about this [laughter] actually uh in a serious between takes they <unk> to to clean it ah the actress [laughter] they were speaking clean on to each other [laughter] so that easy [laughter] um how your foot has is that true i wanna i wanna know <unk> i found it in the most uh of course the most verified and clear source ever <unk> yeah [laughter] ah but um [noise] the beyond the the ah phonology and also the the roman is asian which i'm not <unk> i mean in allentown unless now it's kind of obvious that uh <unk> up in my knowledge <unk> <unk> i think i caught that so i think i'd probably have to say about it [laughter] it all i have a <unk> yeah i guess one of the <unk> uh [laughter] uh uh <unk> sure but beyond that i mean i look to um some other stuff there's not a whole lot online about playing on all i found was these like a set of series of six questions but i got enough about it like there's things like that uses the it uses the um <unk> similar um <unk> that we talked about into a and in in some uh certain uh american indian languages where it in codes this subject and the object in one ethics right i thought yeah so oh go ahead <unk> as you say so i must confess that i have a somewhat fonder memory of <unk> the new dies do simply because i was invented languages before i had the internet [laughter] 'cause i'm the old guy here and getting my hands on the clean on dictionary was a big deal and introduced me to a lot of interesting linguistic ideas i was not going to find in my high school library mhm things like the <unk> or different kinds of ways of approaching claws structure you kind of found a spanish book <unk> <unk> um spanish does not do things at all like oh i <unk> you know i'd already had friends you know one romance languages much like another it was boring right yes he's i knew i wanted to see something new and makes it was just talking to many of an argumentative is has suffered exist but anywhere but i don't know i mean when you're seventeen and there's no internet seeing [noise] um but transiting verbs are conjugate it for subject an object with <unk> that can't be analyze that blew my little mind [laughter] that's kind of like the article i read about it 'cause it's so hard to find anything wrong crowd that i've read articles about people who had about it and they were like oh my god i read that you know just the arab you know you think spanish is hide clean and you have to agree for the subjects and the object and i was like oh god [laughter] so this is an interesting point is that um paramount apparently has been very defensive of this particular bit intellectual property [noise] mhm [noise] so i don't know if they're have actually been problems about people doing things like posting a verb chart [noise] i know they gave us take down on a um i <unk> dictionary i think mhm right so if you listen to the interview the l. c. has did with paul from er um almost two years ago now um they're very preoccupied with this issue of who invented language and cleaning and unfortunately is the bad example because uh paramount it's kind of cranky about it um and uh the inventor um sometimes gives out new words but it's much much harder to get in contact with in saint paul from hers but but has been the ownership issues though has been an issue since climbing on though because not <unk> yeah oh from where is more available and then with those rocky david j. peterson is very available but neither of them can release third reference commerce right near that you're <unk> like i get more publicity and more people interested into it but that's not the way these people are thinking sure but ending of both in the case of both not be indoors rocky there are still [noise] movies and t._v. episodes to be made and they'd probably do not want hate mail from fans say your gender tip is wrong and seen five episodes [laughter] people mess up <unk> [laughter] right and we whoa yeah yeah it er i don't know when it's done they want it done and everything that needs to be canon canonized before they released things like every time i i buy my thing is so many actors have i can tell from snippets of of pulling on that i've heard that not all of the actors are pronouncing it properly and if you're getting the <unk> gone from the t._v. series that may never have been see my okra and it may have been some some some funky with the dictionary working for the script writers apparently the <unk> in the shows can be quite richard it is quite high level 'cause i don't really remember the <unk> that much now but i remember from the <unk> [laughter] but yeah it's but i've i've like ah i recorded one uh song but i'm not going to play but it so obviously was such bad planning on that it didn't even sound like playing on [laughter] [laughter] but anyway [noise] can i say one thing i like about <unk> what is it i like the fact that even now you know <unk> whatever english i liked the fact that he changed that that that would just be like crazy here main way of saying that and that you know it's really <unk> yeah <unk> yeah that yeah that's actually something that i like about what <unk> approach as well is that he took all the establish names and such like playing on and <unk> and <unk> and all that and he decided those are the anglo sized forms of humans you use the they don't have to be the same as the original calling on forms i really liked the way that he did that i agree there and he had two in addition to that he had to try to make brief dialogue that he'd been invented by do hand i think scottie yeah god he's responsible for the clean up in one of the movies yeah i'm at scottie right and and and <unk> had to try to to you know read kind that you have to try to make that makes sense somehow oh [noise] so that that put constraints on them as well <unk> <unk> now when he was alive [laughter] <unk> yes well i play a little bit of playing on singing this is <unk> from some other guy i don't recognize but uh this this this you have an idea of what the the odd sound appealing on [noise] [laughter] oh oh oh oh <unk> oh [noise] [laughter] [noise] uh-huh uh-huh [noise] of any comments on that [laughter] no [laughter] [laughter] so i actually <unk> i collect books on invented languages and hung on dictionary as it must have even if the sound system's weird any or soccer for you it's funky oh i i see it's worse than <unk> [noise] well i think his idea was that if he wrote the the letters upper case it would be a warning but it wasn't the letter you thought it was but something similar yeah he actually i think that was something that he has said about it is uh yeah it was a warning yeah he said it yeah and his or soccer fee is designed for the actors not designed for linguist so [noise] that is yeah i mean i was going to give him a break in that when i was invented i've only taken back it up quite a while ago and he said you were in high school yes i am and i know last year in nineteen eighty five is when the first edition came out okay so let's all live in <unk> ah older than me an older than tiny crime yes [laughter] um so you know i was going to let him off the break and the technology <unk> probably be a lot harder type <unk> so you know [noise] plus he'd already written his dissertation and if you've ever looked at a linguistics dissertation written in the fifties sixties or seventies you wonder how anyone got a degree because it's typewritten except you had to go back with each line with your you pop out the the weird typewriter wheel in sticking to die critics one [laughter] ah well she probably wanted to avoid that yeah i understand that i i i i understand now ah fully the heat why he chose capital letters instead of fur <unk> easy for us all already uh whether we go ahead no go ahead well actually we english speakers can't really complain because at least she has a lecture or digress for each for each sound instead of having to letters which sound or of alias at ray ups and downs [laughter] from <unk> <unk> okay [laughter] well i'm past that training on and <unk> gosh i don't remember i remember you saying i don't know what episode but i'm stuck with cupid english i don't know what it was about but i still remember it [noise] [noise] at least for spelling you know they're like so they backed duckling on [laughter] or one or two things about it did make me crazy um for the most part it is an interesting language dramatically there is nothing obviously where he just threw up his hand and gave up and said i'm just gonna do this like english he's got the training for that not happen that said it's awfully regular [noise] it is isn't it it's <unk> i think it has no we're regular perse so a regular on verbs and no uh did we mentioned that it that the the plural markers on mountains distinguish intimacy short and i think that's the only <unk> cost of <unk> it's so hard to find anything it's kinda [laughter] right so clean <unk> either plural <unk> for basically beans capable of language liberals for body parts and <unk> for everything else right so that's a little joke about these warriors who are hacking people to bit so they're <unk> [laughter] um [noise] the there are a few places where it looks like he just gave up and did three of his hands though so clean on distinguishes conjunctions and and the two kinds of war and you can have one word that's used for joining downs in one word sits used for joining sentences [noise] and they're palin rooms right so the word forehand slash or for joining ounces <unk> and for joining sentences <unk> for either or for <unk> is up and for joining sentences <unk> [laughter] [noise] so that's like that's not natural at all [noise] end up having the body <unk> as a separate thing that we had [noise] maybe <unk> it depends on how you fix i was <unk> i have good go wrong but i was going to get rid of it except for body pie which shortly i tend to come and pass right oh i know that's crazy it is climate maybe it started off life is a dual and then became associated with body parts because people are symmetrical cookie feels like you that says clinging on physiology is not that different from human <unk> yeah let's let's not even [laughter] the old series they let you know face the only difference like they would have beards beards and things were mostly copper skin too <unk> yes yeah yeah yeah i think they use shoot polish for that [noise] that must have smelled wonderful but oh my god [laughter] [laughter] they're livers or destroyed all the clean them [laughter] so it's hard for it yet so i guess the thing is going on if you can find the dictionary for cheap get it it's hard to find online because paramount gives the smack down to people apparently mm i actually want to get the <unk> and every time i watch less but i'd never actually bought it um [noise] it was gonna say something so one of the things that was um [noise] interesting when shortly after appetite came out um erica <unk> different from my girlfriend and <unk> agreed to no answer questions to the new york times some newspaper [noise] it was a huge number of questions that the two of them dealt with and some i'm forgetting how i learned this she thought that clicking on was easier than not be because it didn't have in <unk> but <unk> easy when you get used to them [noise] yeah it takes about a week or two for beginners to get used to them but yeah well half of the issue is that in fixes there you always have to figure out where you have to what you have to figure out where they go because different languages put and fixes in different places in the rich sure but the rules are easy enough and and not be nazi has <unk> it does yes anyway hi maybe you were going to say something [noise] uh i was just going to say that you can't really judge <unk> goldie by whether it has s. s s. s soda feature or not like for example in excess <unk> it's not only that [noise] well that's true <unk> there's the question of how quickly can you get a very basic command of saint not be versus <unk> non um and and be able to say simple sentences um compared to and we'll just ignore the question of having a really deep understanding and the ability to produce complex sentences spontaneously [noise] in my opinion because the morphology of cleveland is so complex even if it is regular it's harder it is playing on does have a lot of a lot of stuff that goes along the river i just think that both the <unk> the <unk> right so there are uh nine ten positions where ethics as can be quiet down to the <unk> gone verb that includes the conjugation and then a whole bunch of other aspect and dependency and other things um evidence reality so on and so forth so i am right now i am so happy spanish this not half and six to ten [laughter] oh my god [noise] yeah well um so he is good but i have a <unk> uh sorry go ahead george <unk> uh i will say playing on at the at the first glance at least i haven't i haven't gone in to see them very deeply but i think playing on does have a lot more and more qualities than uh <unk> and that is one thing that will trip you up learning the language is is lots and lots of <unk> [noise] if you're used to speaking languages that don't have a lot of yeah [laughter] i mean if nothing else [noise] was gonna say i was gonna say something about me clean on desserts props because it's probably the first call on line to have a speaking population that is not people making the movies <unk> into the scenery sheldon sure okay how do people learn how to speak it when i can't find anything on it they go they buy the book you buys you buy stuff either i actually have a <unk> a little bit of sheldon streak inkling on [laughter] putting on isn't that great either yeah it's it's it's not great but i i can play it for you guys here mm no three <unk> we [noise] should be [noise] to that guy just say revenge is a dish best served cold [noise] leaves so [noise] what is wrong with [noise] okay anyway i'll drop a fire but uh [laughter] but <unk> that sort of clean down with a french accent it had he not getting some of the the <unk> and some other weird sounds right [laughter] [laughter] oh well [laughter] what do you expect yep [laughter] [laughter] if you if you if you listen to any of the episode where he tries to learn chinese you understand not good at that sort of thing [noise] anyway [noise] yonkers where you're going to say something i know i just remember my <unk> watching that movie and i think i was not paying attention at the moment [laughter] and i had like trying to think of what i miss head and it wasn't like [laughter] i forget now but it's a horrible joke we have the past that exact <unk> [laughter] [laughter] okay so it just yeah chewing on it's a big everyone should do about it every <unk> should should know a little bit about it just because if you are trying to explain your hobby to people it's and not be or maybe you're only choices woman now now that the movies are out maybe you know <unk> my popular now uh yeah i think it obvious yes i'd say <unk> v. playing on and tell <unk> <unk> maybe both rocky and a lot of circles who camera thrown just very i'd never even heard of that twenty guys talked about it [laughter] you must not have h._b._o. now i have a t._v. show on [noise] you don't have a t._v. now i guess on crafts watch my <unk> oh okay yeah there's there's a problem of you don't have anything any uh you have to have h._b._o. the sea game which was a <unk> which is a barrier for a lot of people and it's going to be a barrier to the number of people who have heard about those rocky anyway i think i am going <unk> uh do we have anything else to say about <unk> oh i work did you say two things that really police me was the vocabulary because i thought they were hilarious [laughter] one of them as well you know from from a certain season uh you had <unk> forehead yeah as opposed to the first season [noise] so the worst insult you can tell too <unk> <unk> it's okay let me get this right <unk> <unk> <unk> ah well anyway <unk> literally means your mother has a smooth forehead yeah that that is that is a funny thing i yeah i figure reminded me of beyond cat calling table safer [laughter] it really had okay [laughter] it's understandable when it's gonna make calling out of it so [laughter] well i don't like that she's actually listened to last [laughter] yeah [laughter] yeah i don't even think drug why argue goes the whole upset [noise] well i think if that's all we have to say about playing i'll wait for one more thing just one more thing [laughter] i really liked the ward for fish which <unk> dog tea which is right in <unk> in english <unk> i hate that child the child doesn't lack it's it's it's funny when you first start learning what now what kind of funny when i first started land and it's funny <unk> you know just go with it but it's clearly wrong so it's not funny [laughter] <unk> here's the free skating cars to please [laughter] now [laughter] [noise] uh but um no it's it's it's funny at the start later on you you realize that it doesn't really hold up very well but anyway it's kind too high but it was clever that's what i don't like about it i've been trying for a few minutes could wrap this episode up so [laughter] we have um but yeah any con lying is going to have some interesting little jokes written into it but uh i like i think we can wrap this thing up if nobody has anything else to say any <unk> well now getting [laughter] any partying words of wisdom from bianca and i'll uh for um <unk> um not really [laughter] from william <unk> [laughter] [laughter] and <unk> which i don't understand what that means success oh okay i'm calling um and i <unk> i knew that on um i am going to say i'm going to in here insert something in planning on and then say happy called like thank you for listening to con lying or you can find all our episodes and show notes as well as subscribed to r. i. too or are assess speeds through con library dot <unk> dot org you can also like our face book page or follow at con library on put her if you would like to contact us with corrections comets questions or suggestions or even suggest your own caught lying is a future please a male harmless angry at g. e. mail dot com or call in to our new voicemail lard three zero four eight seven three six to eight one [noise] we also have a handy suggestions more on our side or the reason why then there was a mm mm mm mm mm mm mm mm mm

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  1. Conlangery Podcast
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Conlangery Podcast/Conlangery 16 Tense (last edited 2017-09-06 06:00:02 by TranscriBot)