Conlangery #54: Reduplication

Conlangery #54: Reduplication

Published: Mon, 11 Jun 2012 04:00:17 +0000 \

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Transcript

utterance-id1 i'm at the <unk> <unk> <unk> [noise] <unk> maybe just two people who create them aren't really with me in wisconsin is william and hello and i almost didn't uh pronounce <unk> over in new jersey we and my my team hello who is having some internet troubles but we think we can we can uh <unk> uh but uh i my fingers crossed so um how are you guys doing i'm doing well just got off for work um home and when i'm alone weekend so that's nice mhm <unk> yeah it'd be looking forward to the cooler weather maybe a little bit warm today yeah well [laughter] yeah well i'm taking a break yeah i'm taking a break from staring at dictionaries but otherwise it's cooler here already that makes me happy happy it's good <unk> good <unk> good yeah yeah the <unk> the last episode your um your the sars nope your baby uh-huh so william just recently kurdish they document cold <unk> the source which i understand is sort of still under revisions but yeah so a lot of the work that went into it was came out of reading i was doing ah theories grammar that are [noise] alternatives to generate a grammar which i think it's insane it makes no sense [laughter] and so i happened to run across some interesting cross linguistics demented maps and they knew that's neat and that would also be a useful tool [noise] so i found if many of those that i could but there aren't too many um available pretty neat um so what i've been doing recently is writing some code to generate crossing was <unk> on my own cool um and as i come across new information the new hierarchies new maps i had them to the document so i expect it will be changing a lot at least for the next year or so but hopefully after people will find it useful yeah this sounds awesome it looks looks very nice [noise] well our power of let's heck right [laughter] i can make complete nonsense look very nice of attack but hey [laughter] but uh i i i like that you're doing original uh research but may i ask you to help me with my thesis when that comes around [laughter] if i if i end up having to do anything any copy occasional stuff mhm uh-huh every <unk> every calming or should know how to program a little but any way that topic for another show mhm computers [laughter] are they really uh programming languages are or their own thing but yeah we're about anything like that well yeah i was gonna say everytime anybody's like but computer languages language and i'm a <unk> a little bit it it's called one but um [noise] my comparison interesting day that a programming language is like a human language the same way a protein is like an elephant huh [laughter] yeah that's a very i may i may steal that they both involved organic chemistry but that doesn't mean they're the pain [laughter] very that's very adequate an actor but anyway yeah um there's some interesting online sitter inspired by programming languages but we're not gonna get it that goes [laughter] today is <unk> and actually well you you suggested that i <unk> yeah why is that um what was the practical because it covers the whole bunch of different kinds of things that inter relate ride morphology phonology syntax other kinds of grammar [noise] um mainly they wanted to put it on is i remember very well the first time i looked at the walls matt showing how common redo publication is which is to say it is everywhere except western europe [laughter] it is insane <unk> common compare and really i think highly under use income like compared to how often it occurs at a natural language national languages so i thought it would be a good thing to discuss oh no that's why oh yeah there's lots of review on yeah you see the map it everywhere right um but not france huh i <unk> i <unk> i guess um [noise] for all the definition is kind of specific 'cause we're duplication in english but it's a very limited very very limited [noise] and it's not really um i guess it's sort of productive but it only very few things going on uh so let's get into what we're duplication is by [noise] for some reason you have never heard the term redo publication is where you basically repeat part um hey ah ate the whole a whole morphine or part of a morphine or or it could be a whole word yep mhm for some particular um usually uh too as a sort of a grammatical inflection uh they they they uh english use of it is very uh <unk> <unk> yeah so i guess if we could linked the salad solid paper it's you know [laughter] basically that you are noticing uh i get it but it would be difficult right years electing the odor type something yeah yeah the the typical or there there are a few others but oh oh right did you have to the salad or salads salads is that like <unk> <unk> do like him or do you like him like him right it can be used for things like that as well see i thought now yeah that's [noise] uh-huh that's more of an intensive i think now is is an example like teeny tiny an example of <unk> with an vowel to nation or no um i think it is i mean we can get i mean <unk> why do we just jump in and go with various kinds of patterns couldn't teeny tiny is a somewhat funky example but doesn't occur in other languages mhm um <unk> [noise] to my mind teeny tiny is a kind of video phone and we know that they do petitioning popular there anyway she'll be jumping just straight into various shaped we'll start with the shapes and then the next <unk> two ways to choose what pungent yeah because the the i was just so <unk> using the english example as as a clue what will get into more used as later so different kinds of form so i think the most obvious one is where are you <unk> either morphine we're we're right yeah so most often it is either an entire word or the front end of a word where redo the asian is happening uh-huh you can rarely have ah <unk> the last a little over word mhm and even more rarely you can <unk> in the middle of a word and that's pretty darn rare yeah um and if you really like fund fund a logical processes redo publication is for you because [noise] once you're duplication has happened to all sorts of fun logical mischief and mayhem can happen mhm [noise] so i'm going to get one example from sanskrit and then we can go down through the type you know the sort of um inventory of kinds of predict <unk> so the prison tend to go in sanskrit <unk> <unk> <unk> means i'd go and the root is gum g. a. m. and the perfect is joe gum so that that doesn't sound or duplicated 'cause they're all different <unk> what has happened is the original re duplication bible was a rental which <unk> all dealers into africa mhm so you had instead of you had gum and then the <unk> with <unk> was gay gum but then <unk> became j. gum but then short e. n. o. emerged into the town and so you got <unk> huh so you only have <unk> evidence what used to be a front <unk> [noise] and this is a regular ruin sanskrit so you can have all sorts of fun with your were duplicating beyond the very simple transparent patterns we're about two months to go through like a <unk> <unk> it is [laughter] they are <unk> [laughter] all right so we've mentioned a few times the simplest kind every duplication is simply to repeat the word um indonesian mainly use this to mark plural now so <unk> is <unk> and <unk> is books oh that's awesome yeah very simple um sometimes you might have some other kind of morphology introduce myself into this process so i found one language <unk> new guinea called <unk> <unk> <unk> where you eat when you make a certain kind of uh plural you do repeated but you also at a morphine to both copies so um yeah <unk> that means village uh-huh <unk> means various religions right so you have <unk> um thing mhm oh okay right right so simple word rehabilitation as possible um but then you could do is simply repeat the entire first <unk> mhm mhm and that's easy so i'm gonna have a fake word i was just gonna put on sunday and redo publication version that would be some some day now once you've got the patterns on sunday you can do all sorts of things you can shift an accent around if it's a total language you might shift tone mhm um and you might reduce the bottle of the reduced dictated syllable either in the copy or the original mhm so from sunday you might get some some day or even some sunday um which you know does various reduction too the double syllable mhm um or you might do sunday to um some some day or even something day uh-huh where the original syllable gets reduced in various ways [noise] it makes me makes me think that example <unk> odd to me because i think of <unk> be reduced i i read that it's some some day but rage one you don't want the accent that at some languages are okay that <unk> accent <unk> or something but um that's cool i liked the idea of using fond logical processes to make her do publication less transparent yeah i think <unk> probably one reason that you <unk> do we do play station that often i think one reason may be that too english speakers it sounds silly and mhm and uh so by adding found a logical process if you're the kind of person that feels that it's it sounds a little silly you can [noise] um [noise] <unk> <unk> do a little bit of the silliness by making it less parents right right yeah [noise] um [noise] oh okay that's fine so that fool syllable um redo playstation um another pattern is you could echo the onset plus nucleus believe about dakota mhm mhm so you would go from sunday to sunday uh-huh um again with a normal pattern you might get i'll reduction in my place or another um [noise] now you oh go ahead um you mentioned dollar <unk> but um and this might be covered down a little bit but what if it's uh the <unk> <unk> what could you have <unk> [noise] those guys the limit all sorts of fun things can happen once you've decided what's going on i mean you might have um a father tactic rule mhm that you know doesn't allow you to have the sequence um on in an accented syllable mhm so you could have sunday go to saw some day but then we decided that that's illegal so it becomes saw some day you know there's also i mean raising lowering oh yeah yeah all sorts of things you could even have like um in the the sunday sunday example you could have uh final and get law legalization so that you have found that [noise] you know right and in <unk> in the european huh they had they permitted um nasal and residents to be a syllable nuclear <unk> oh you had you had <unk> and m. r. n. l. but by the time you've got to greek greek said oh no [laughter] and man <unk> and and <unk> em became the bible [laughter] [laughter] wow which means that you have some nasal damn redo location patterns in greek worthy any disappears altogether and suddenly have an hour [laughter] once you've been told that happened to that you can see the pattern but it's very puzzling different seventies jeopardy greek and thinking wow you go into the into the enron and greek uh modern greek no longer uses the forms that we're using nuclear fission um oh i mean i'm sure there's a few little <unk> laying around but mostly it's gone [laughter] and another thing you could do is if you do not permit boyce lose confidence between vowels mhm you can have voicing um led mission all sorts of fun things you can do so it's just a goody bag of what you can do that's what i said if you like from logical process conditions you're should be here to love it i actually uh i don't know if you if you want to do <unk> go back and listen to our biological process is up so probably all of those different things are much too and more could be applied to make your duplicate more interesting yep yep [noise] so [noise] another pattern every duplication which is very simple is to simply repeat the initial confident but you always use the same level mhm mhm so that's how ancient greek uh created the perfect is the initial confident plus uh x. along so the <unk> to stop bow all became they ball and to steal which was clicked all become <unk> which uh through some other weird change it but that's a very simple things you just use the same bowl um and copy initial compton huh but with me though is the greek did that for the perfect it had a small number of birds who's present <unk> also had to do <unk> but they use the different huh um see all this stuff seems to indicate that you're you're constantly is preserve i'm starting to think that something i didn't y'all cock his very unnatural when i i had in your car was the last the vowel in the name of a verb gets repeated with an intervening he took more in the <unk> that's not natural is it uh no no no no no i would say i would not interpret that is <unk> is you had a final constant t. added and then you've got an echo vowel mhm oh jogging on the previews syllable and and that does happen in [noise] okay so that's that's a different process when i was doing it wasn't really <unk> yeah now you're uh you're the costs are about this uh maybe this is what you just mentioned about the initial see could that break up constant clusters right so that's a nightmare [laughter] it was constant clusters with greek you have to memorize several patterns oh [laughter] it depends i mean your language may not allow very complex unsaid clusters anyway uh-huh rica's a disaster because it's a nice dinner <unk> language even have pretty darn complex um onset mhm um [noise] it depends like the example i gave for steel clicked all <unk> so they're obviously stop plus resident you just read <unk> mm <unk> never read duplicate a cluster yeah but what it does do with that cluster is different from depending on your <unk> like once an ex gets involved all sorts of <unk> all bets are off yeah i have [laughter] redo publication in <unk> in one of my car on line with them a break up that cluster and <unk> [laughter] right right [noise] um [noise] <unk> <unk> <unk> one thing that uh how'd you mention is vietnam means there's a lot of kind of um express every duplication that modify the meanings of adjectives in various way uh-huh um and one of their common patterns is to repeat the initial confidence mhm but they have a wide variety of replacement dakota's <unk> and uh nuclear oh um i think today included list [noise] no i have a paper that had moan and <unk> which has a lot of the same sort of stuff [noise] okay um so i mentioned that um another thing about this thing will come and then plus stuff <unk> is it can involve more than one syllable yeah turkish in particular has a bunch of these expressive adjective um intense them for the most part which can have two syllable mhm mhm i produce as a result but [noise] um and and another complexity is it your route starts with a viable well then how do you <unk> you can like send the vowel which is what ancient greek uncensored do sometimes um you can do some kind of funky i bloat right you think should make a chart of changes would send me regularity see do you like a nice naturalistic confusing language um you can do <unk> constant constant <unk> like if if you had the fake word <unk> you could do <unk> um i guess they in ancient greek most of the time the bottles lengthened but a small number do this kind of um repeat the <unk> with the <unk> <unk> the boundaries of the the duplication or you can make a god will stop at the beginning the word a separate morphine and you can have a little better there at the beginning of the work like huh mhm mhm [noise] if they did that could they i mean i <unk> and i guess it's almost <unk> could you do it 'cause it seems like you could do almost anything but if you <unk> could you possibly have <unk> have that gee be <unk> uh i don't know if that would be up in <unk> sure you can have the you could have some sort of random stops a little inserted in there sure some <unk> i mean there's many possibilities of what you have to like to do [noise] so do most languages actually put [noise] sort of a <unk> or a um hey val initial word [noise] um that depends if you're language has a global stop at all in the middle of a word uh-huh or at the end of a word then i would expect it to be paid attention to the beginning of work okay but i mean even just um i remember correctly it came to my attention fairly recently that english actually in search a global stop at the beginning of rebel initial we're going after i <unk> yeah yeah we don't know yeah and it only happens at the beginning of a difference or um [noise] i know the you know spanish <unk> two girls come close together crossword <unk> boundaries they actually blend together yeah um i i think that mostly happens in english across an intonation unit but at the beginning of an occurrence after you've stopped sticky breath or stop to think are starting new sentence [noise] then we're much more likely to have the <unk> obviously there <unk> <unk> well i guess some it has to be there [laughter] yeah it could be it could be i like it doesn't have to be their languages distinguish words to begin with vowels and words to begin with well stopped followed by bowl mhm mm okay so it's not like it's a requirement i just noticed uh like um whenever i see arabic words transcribed almost anything that that has uh vowel <unk> near the beginning doesn't have another constant has a global stop before the bal yeah i don't know if that happens all the time in arabic no where to begin with anything except the <unk> oh really well they put a global stopping okay yeah even like that's how i felt like i thought the er that's an article and all but i guess maybe those <unk> uh right there is harsh will rules for religion for that and one or two other words but for the most part if the word yeah no you're gulf subjects but yeah and maybe the olive might have a lot of uh you know i think there's different there's a lot of <unk> uh <unk> yeah you have a <unk> yeah but anyway um okay let's let's get back i was a <unk> little <unk> little digression on the <unk> um and just in terms of simple <unk> system these are really all the kinds of <unk> that can happen but even you can tell and the discussion we've had so far the implications of these simple rules can be pretty wide ranging mhm um and every pattern we've talked about so far can also play out in vinyl syllable or internal <unk> implications although i have to be honest i've never heard of internal syllable <unk> involves multiple syllables huh um although you know that doesn't mean it doesn't exist i just can't think of an example where i've seen that i would almost think of internal syllable <unk> maybe historically arriving from uh there was <unk> and then ah prefix got added to it sure well i'm looking at uh the <unk> the bottom of the sun uh shows um that some of them has an internal <unk> um like somali is he or she walk [noise] and then some of <unk> and they walk but i don't like any other like you said they don't really have anything layer it on top of that it seems right yeah i'm like i think um i think maybe in your craig example on sunday was uh laurel and then they're <unk> they're developed and <unk> and you get mixed on sunday [noise] but i'm sure that that i mean that makes sense that makes sense um uh what else to say a small number of languages have triple occasion [laughter] [laughter] that's fun which i've only ever heard being used for expressive purposes not for grammatical purposes riley's like him very very foolish rather than foolish or something like that well i mean we can we can ah in english [noise] even uh go up to like five but but not grammatical or anything yet [noise] people saying that they were it over again yeah it's just sort of repeating for emphasis i know you hate the word emphasis but i don't know another way to earn his hair was gonna explode [laughter] [laughter] oh [noise] <unk> <unk> the shapes the preview location well there's um about the fun function well really kept one yeah just one i'm looking at the computer and it's a really interesting with the p. t. i don't know if you guys have looked at it or not but eventually the direction of copying and i guess you don't really talk to them from the centre towards the outside you can move um but it's less common <unk> indianapolis like uh if god is <unk> er <unk> as for i <unk> might be eyes and they took the lack of confidence shifted it from uh for <unk> er too she has uh the other direction yeah yeah those are very very rare but yet you're right there are some um some processes and maybe it's <unk> i mean in the sense that something is being repeated uh-huh but it's been like <unk> he didn't by being picked up and moved to another part of the word mhm right were duplicating sort of happens in place to things or next to each other [noise] mhm [noise] um yeah but as you as as the articles and and you said that's very rare yeah hawaii um before we get out of forums actually i'm one of <unk> uh mentioned one thing um an odd thing and train these chinese actually doesn't have that much for duplicate shoo mm uh um yes people could drink but one thing that i forgot about until i saw it in the <unk> um in certain time or if you make words [laughter] um chinese will <unk> boat morphine so tiny the school of these two character compounds silver duplicate boat <unk> so uh not in the way you expect so for example louis u. p. d. it gives it <unk> meaning beautiful it <unk> it grew duplicate uh <unk> <unk> <unk> yeah yeah that that <unk> [laughter] [laughter] just gross yeah yeah yeah that's neat um and then it shows compound verbs though our <unk> our uh it gives show c._n._n. sociology show she [noise] so yeah yeah <unk> it's it's adjectives do that specifically i adjectives that have two more teams the goal uh for um it's it's for the that sort of inter indirect um sort of she's sort of a way um um giving a couple of it anyway let's let's not real far into it to 'em into chinese but yeah um well i didn't want to make sure there's one uh-huh there's one really funky thing in canton name uh-huh for certain kinds of adjectives <unk> where it's it's the form is eight a. b. and what's funny about it is typically what will happen is the first two were just will be in cantonese repeated and the second word <unk> typically from um uh some straight <unk> dialect oh wow so it will be chinese white white and then montclair white [laughter] huh so weird [noise] i'll find me i'll find the article one or two articles of talk about that and get those into the showed up because it's fun you know for some world building if you want [laughter] introduce similar redo publication but borrow them from someone else an interesting possibility there but anyway i guess my <unk> chinese chinese has a lot of <unk> christian but mostly for <unk> purposes um and we're going to get into use it and it's really when you get down into <unk> looks like there's a lot of actual nitty gritty grammatical so why don't we go into that well all right um so i guess the first an obvious used for these and what i've already mentioned briefly is tomorrow <unk> [noise] mhm [noise] now that's really liberal right you just say them down twice but you might get this on the verbs done okay in which case it might mean plural subject it might mean plural object it might mean it might following or get if pattern and mean multiple objects with transit of herbs and multiple subject within transit of her huh [noise] um i've i've seen all of these in some language rather um you might have uh a normal boring ethics kind of <unk> and you used to be duplicated plural too mark a distributor plural huh mhm like people all over the place [noise] person by person that sort of sense um and in languages with a lot of <unk> if numbers get reciprocated this distributed sense is very common you know like four by four to buy do mhm huh [laughter] [noise] um if you were duped <unk> excuse me you <unk> you were verb um <unk> might add distributive sense too demeaning right and that means something to do something here and there or do something back and forth mm uh-huh right so you could you know i plant plant trees wouldn't mean that you plant trees here and they're all over the place mhm [laughter] mhm like johnny appleseed right johnny appleseed <unk> [noise] um i i i <unk> i come back the chinese again because they do [noise] but they don't have <unk> but there's one that seems like very similar where <unk> becomes regroup located to <unk> to mean basically i think <unk> every one <unk> uh-huh yeah yeah exactly exactly that's sort of thing [noise] um yeah now uh i'm sorry go ahead no just gonna say um that i'm surprised that i haven't really seen case um they're not little uh that we mentioned that i don't know if maybe this case them <unk> maybe i should i have not ever scenery duplicate and you're smart case that's interesting i mean it feels a little wrong to even think about using that i don't know if that's just because i haven't seen her before yeah now in some sense redo publication is always to some degree or other i comic mhm and there are various things that that <unk> repetition can signify mhm but i have a hard time seeing i mean that's just not my cake marks case markers do case workers are entirely <unk> how does this work relate to the er yeah pretty much everything but i mean you listed on your little thing huh or things that sort of magically make scripted <unk> were duplicating obviously <unk> makes a whole lot of sense yeah okay you have two or more of something how do you express that you say it twice [noise] sure mhm um and the the sort of the the distributive stuff and going further you are also mentioned tents aspect and particularly habitual in theater senses right again <unk> of the the <unk> the [noise] given structure that you're describing yeah mhm um i mean once you've decided redo publications grammatical process i i mean it seems a little weird to me but i'm not going to say it's impossible for human to be able to pick up <unk> as a grammatical marker or like a case worker now is um [noise] i'm sorry <unk> yeah it's it's not necessarily out of the room <unk> we've <unk> we don't know of an example in natural language [laughter] never seen them yeah uh mike you were saying well i was going to say we're going through the functions here and in languages with three duplication does she do <unk> usually only serve one purpose or kinda be like an english <unk> s on me and can be either <unk> or a third person or or um [noise] a bird conjugation does <unk> have that kind of um [noise] multiple applications in languages with in languages that have <unk> any store they are very likely to have more than one <unk> into senses it's more likely to be used like multiple different kinds of patterns of predict location are available mhm mhm um like i talked about what the asian greek really only has one productive form but they're still two to five other marginal minor types that are still use for things [noise] um and then the next question is function you might have or duplication use for multiple function now in ancient greek <unk> only ever used on <unk> but in a language like squeamish [noise] which is the same language from my favorite place is if it weren't northwest readership occasion marks various kinds of number related things are now and then she was from various purposes <unk> mhm [noise] um aspect number the union all sorts of stuff and then you get to be i mean where all words are subject she potentially subjects were duplicating which can have different kinds of me mhm [noise] so it's pretty darn rare to have <unk> and and have it be a tiny little kind of ridiculous that happens in one instance and in one patter mhm mhm cool yeah yeah [noise] um another thing <unk> is reciprocal mhm um and once you've got your typical typical offering dramatic lives to middle or reflects him so once you've got that that you can move on that way mhm um um uh i i just want to say reciprocal is uh over again in case somebody doesn't know a reciprocal generally is like uh he and she kissed each other right it's where you do some action you can read it on the right to to each other that <unk> you're you're doing it back and forth and that makes sense [noise] i get you back to the verb and it means that it goes in both directions [noise] yep [noise] um and then they were saying that we do publication and can mark and this is kind of funny is it has to do with intensity and <unk> and that's classically like adjectives like someone you can say that someone's angry mhm and my favorite languages vietnamese because it has one pattern that would be used to say that someone is a very angry uh-huh and another pattern it's used in say someone's a little bit angry [laughter] or or or you know uh-huh somewhat angry and both of them are different kinds of redo playstation patterns so again i mean different human languages you might get either administrative reducing reducing sense or you might get in intensive increasing sense for your language might allow it to me either you just have to buy her yeah they show that on the on the computer they have ah vietnamese and they say they're found abundantly yes they are oh yeah oh it's um i wish i knew how to pronounce it so i'm not just looking at these symbol going oh at one of the <unk> right [laughter] yeah you you kind of a <unk> a little bit of a lot and you skipped over a little bit uh the the uh the minute it but it's interesting i know that chinese almost uses the same patterns for both but i think they apply to different work classes right <unk> exactly how that works but um there's all sorts of things that you can uh you can do there um but that's that that would be an interesting thing to habit habit <unk> low impact the in high in penn state and meet contacts who ah distinguish them [noise] sure i mean in the vietnamese <unk> there are different patterns of <unk> <unk> right it's it's different patterns see it's yeah <unk> well i mean it's transparent in the sense that you're not going to have one word that can both me very angry and a little bit angry if not transparent in the sense that it's very hard and linguist and history <unk> theory falling logical types get very agitated trying to figure out what the hell even easier duplication patterns are huh [laughter] oh now i'm i'm looking at um i'm looking actually at the uh the increasing in penn state for written i mean [laughter] there's something crazy going on yeah yeah i don't know how to pronounce vietnamese but these forms look very different yeah yeah [laughter] yeah they're very different looking <unk> <unk> yeah if you're doing um um uh more or less analytical language and you decide you wanted to redo publication vietnamese is you go to source of inspiration for that knew hands down and it uses it uses the latin alphabet but it's uh it's really kind of crazy looking anyway [laughter] [noise] right well vietnam me is use <unk> for a language study that be let out but it's not well adapted pork so yet tax so like up to three diet critics on a ah <unk> yeah they did they did it the <unk> the [noise] it is it's well as they could move on [noise] um we've been over hatred of the vietnamese or soccer <unk> before [noise] mike yes of course um but i was gonna say so we've talked about what we're talking about farming and even here we're talking a different kind of <unk> you can <unk> you can <unk> get the ah the <unk> or you can read <unk> the <unk> and the nuclear but could you ever just if you just take the nucleus on a stick um uh uh constantly front i don't think that's <unk> that's just like a prefix right well um [noise] [noise] yeah that's interesting question at once again vietnamese does this [laughter] but mostly my understanding of this process is mostly working that kids play <unk> were they mango words by taking the onset of the syllable and the code ah and then ripping them apart and putting mixing and matching other parts on them mhm mhm um which again has an <unk> of the other stuff that goes on in <unk> i honestly looked at him once and i got very confused so i just put it down in one way and do something else [noise] i just find it more or look at it the more interesting things become there's someone he uses for the function yeah yeah so [laughter] you can get into more functions outta the way that are on my list here and we can move up and so you wonder <unk> um in front of a new european they derived they should've from [noise] with your duplication and that is what became um in later sanskrit and read the perfect mhm [noise] um and then the last thing and this is just a huge catch all you can use <unk> for lexical derivation of various kinds [noise] some of it's pretty i <unk> you know intense things you know the difference between <unk> um that sort of stuff it's run by <unk> thing to me um i i'm just gonna say it's very interesting to me that p. i. e. had reduced location but hey it disappeared in all of western europe yep right anyway the old english only <unk> retained a little <unk> of redo publication in one dialect in certain poetic forms [laughter] on the ricky mentions english and what uh replacing english hot right um i was gonna say like school derivation <unk> another thing i saw some where i was probably in in a language of pop one new guinea <unk> re duplicating <unk> made the agent now huh so like run two runner was you know when when became runner huh that's interesting right so have you can do things that that's a little less obviously i comic but it's so there there's plenty you can do there but i guess that makes sense don't someone who run enron might be as a runner so i mean you can oh sure and the characteristics i guess it kinda makes it yeah um but i was looking at <unk> we were talking about the the topic plethora of functions up is wonderful one across the time [noise] and um some of the interesting one that mention down here on the <unk> like conceptual similarity so um i'm going to probably my my ankle this but it's an um a lion and the news and it says uh the <unk> <unk> <unk> it's very productive and they have for uh conceptual similarity like <unk> and sealing our power versus long beach which is the sky or um they mentioned here's one i don't quite understand diversity or non exhaust <unk> so it says uh that's the latest speech there and it says all those birds are all <unk> export out of the country <unk> only to do that or <unk> so i guess lots of different things i never thought about [noise] uh [noise] right yeah there's there's lots of <unk> um we could be the article i just to go quickly it's already that seems pretty darn exhausted on awesome [laughter] [noise] i seem to recall looking that in the last few years in finding it very thin set of someone obviously decided it needed attention [noise] um i'm wondering if there's anything i included a few links um a few documents here that george will lincoln spoke on that we have a free online spoke on grammar which is a sandwich and language and starting age a hundred and eleven are huge number of things that it does too <unk> various were duplicating patterns that happened to verbs where you can check those out [noise] um for an example of somewhat complex logical processes combined with many kinds of <unk> um i have a link to a paper on about two language that deserves kinds of <unk> um i got an article on the turkish intensive adjectives which are pretty fun [noise] and then the the <unk> link [noise] is there anything else we need to say about the wonders process that israel implications uh [noise] it's just a whole bunch of awesome [laughter] george <unk> is a huge thing you can and there's a whole lot of different options were you to add into your online and i think you know i've seen a few <unk> have some were duplicating in them but it's always great to see some more uh yeah no i mean there are like there are companies that have it but it seems very few compared to how popular it actually is a natural language you mean like every i hope that we the um some people and in fact i will i will challenge people to send us some interesting uh examples in their own online yeah that'd be cool uh uh <unk> and what they've done with it because um you know there's a lot where you can do with it i think i may uh start using <unk> a little bit more 'cause mhm it's come to my attention that in some ways like thinking like <unk> it's kind of boring uh european as <unk> in some way mm i've <unk> we've all we've all made them yeah may i use the duplication mine right [laughter] does it mean uh use it for <unk> obviously you know but then i'm gonna i was had no idea of the plethora of how how much more i could do for you [laughter] i'm not <unk> well i <unk> i keep asking questions but um would you use <unk> for <unk> for plural would an added to agree with that and have a new place on the attitude as well i think that's up to you that's terribly <unk> mm i haven't really if you're if you're adjectives are kind of more verbal like that now i'm like that i would absolutely expect them to be marked for number yeah i have um read appreciation but then there's some valentine's it goes on with our case marketing so it's a whole bunch of <unk> <unk> um parfait layers going on there yeah so <unk> are we ready for a son that way some l._a. george mhm sure let's go i'm here [laughter] yes let's go on to sundown away so sunday's our way is quite a sign language may behind if you don't know what that means that is a it basically the language family were clicks or believe too heavy originated isn't that i will i will add to the note that the only reason sunday is class that way it is because it has cliques it has been very very hard to demonstrate it's relationship to the other family to the other languages really so you're not actually be quite certain it may just an accident so could way up in tanzania is also confusing <unk> is it <unk> is er clicking uh i thought it was <unk> different no uh there's there's a language called <unk> which is actually a <unk> language yeah [laughter] i was confused by that earlier book as well spoken in south africa um most click languages are in sort of south africa they're about yeah but apparently like i'm always up in <unk> near man people are not sure why but there there are no natural click languages outside of <unk> [noise] well there's one weirdness of the ritual language and that one regional language in australia but we'll just ignore that for now but we we kinda anyway that was on line but uh yeah uh for the purposes of the show there are no natural language is outside of africa that have click [noise] i'd <unk> because there's not very many languages which click [noise] [noise] i'm surprised <unk> <unk> <unk> what no go ahead i was just going to say i'm surprised with all the language is like in the america or you know and like china or <unk> okay in the world that there are just there i'm <unk> i'm really surprised me well i think about it this way <unk> constant in any of them they're like the most difficult um speech sound i up and counter [laughter] mhm so especially when you get into some dollars so let's talk a little bit about the knowledge <unk> sunday l._a. um let's let's we'll get back to cliques in a second but even just the basic <unk> inventory excluding the quick [noise] mhm you have a three way closer district uh um the distinction <unk> plain voice list i spirited and voice which occurs other places but you know it it it makes for a a larger inventory yeah then you get into craziness [noise] with um you have so the closest all lined up to put uh uh and then it has global stop which of course you had no distinctions it's just plain ah because you can't you avoid [laughter] and i'm <unk> is awkward [laughter] um <unk> but then you get into the africa car in places of articulation that the postage is never going to at least the plane africa car uh uh uh uh <unk> uh <unk> i'm not that weird but it's kind of uh uh it's it's actually not that we're africa's <unk> sort of weird like there are <unk> so i don't know why uh uh <unk> <unk> not objective active but it it has ah [noise] ah and then ah so reject is that er massively um massively uh eight symmetrical with the rest of your face from a guy that's the word i was looking for [laughter] and stuff and and other than that it's pretty normal i mean it's there's a metric cold but it's natural <unk> it's very it's very common <unk> trees like um there's only em em and and well lots of languages do that and um i guess there's only one lateral <unk> there's also uh lateral crickets [noise] ah now getting into the click uh-huh the click click click [noise] there are three click right it's debate then had and then we talked about before in the the show and we talked about yeah dental <unk> lateral uh-huh uh-huh uh-huh uh-huh well that's right and it <unk> they come in hi labor [noise] [laughter] right [laughter] voice less aspirin it voice was asked graded voice nasal wise i <unk> see another example of why i think click should be thought of as places of articulation not come [laughter] well you can you uh you produce all of those distinctions in a click no [laughter] no i mean i was just trying to wrap my head around uh voice click voiced an aspirin or the ones i have the most trouble with like uh in some of these languages things they called voice click to me sound an awful lot like a normal click followed by um <unk> um thinking well maybe it i'm sorry yeah i i was reading uh uh a video and i i was watching a video rather and about another language that that will give me that gives some examples um different things and they have a voice hounded like the woman was trying to make you say uh the uh <unk> <unk> <unk> the woman describes it as like grunting into it but i'm not sure um the mayor life seems is pretty straightforward it <unk> it is yeah yeah mm yeah nah nah yeah mm <unk> mm [laughter] yeah [laughter] i'm a lot of lives is weird but you can get it it's ah yeah ah ah ah it's almost like in a chick flick ah [noise] um but yeah ask graded i have no freaking clue now all right how to how to um [noise] do all these how <unk> <unk> are all these um <unk> what's the word uh <unk> uh they're all they're all phony but they're all yeah in my early yes they are contrasting yeah thank you they are all <unk> [laughter] right and if you look later in the notes it looks like some of them also occur in um <unk> ooh yeah <unk> yeah yeah with all of this this actually gives the language a pretty large um constant inventory i haven't gotten around the counting that's okay um there's a lot of them that's normal for them [laughter] but yeah but it's a lot it's not maybe not quite <unk> level but it it's a lot <unk> uh-huh sorry go ahead no no no i'm sorry <unk> must be ah yeah sorry okay um and finally round out the basic inventory the vowels are a little more boring but it's a basic uh five hours system <unk> with long version and also nasal made wise versions which the nasal as virgins are also long mhm [noise] but there's also toe <unk> from being too boring we have high and low tone and then various um yes the <unk> the system is very interesting because it's kind of um [noise] <unk> <unk> a lot of different tone powder in phones but it's still not quite like whole on crazy concord town right you get contra returns but they're the result of certain front electrical process so when you say <unk> that would really like junior high and low you have moves around what you think of from chinese like topic from <unk> ah well uh-huh this is mostly high and low but uh i like a couple <unk> <unk> like going from load a high and high low [noise] um there's <unk> apparently yeah there's there's different tone pattern but they're all basically derived from like high and low [noise] um [noise] what i was going to say earlier what this is for all those people who think the african languages are primitive and primitive means easy uh no no no [laughter] no [laughter] so we spend a lot of time on the phonology and that doesn't even get into the fun of the fun logical processes syllable structures are not terribly complicated in some <unk> but um we have uh one morphine that very very important to that is entirely made up of super sick mental <unk> uh-huh [laughter] right is quite hilarious right does that apply to a particular syllable or something yeah texas tech down to the end it's like a normal harvey right you just suck fix it but then but it only appears because it changes they [laughter] they don't talk about it a lot but there are various kinds of old contraction that happened that not only result in tone hanky panky but vowel quality changes <unk> i'm looking at some of these some of the uh sampled here in is there a d. voicing our vows <unk> the under snoop circles for i forget what that underneath circle me i think it's i i know sometimes if it's above like a needle work for d. voicing but i'm not sure what to <unk> uh <unk> can be divorcing too um i <unk> i should say this um this particular um documented mostly using i p._a. what i think you might have <unk> uh which you know as i was saying before the show uh is kind of um kind of disappoints because i have an interest in how true <unk> click because basically no letter in the roman alphabet actually really fit what a click is so i know that in other click languages in fact maybe we can find the <unk> of her sons outlay let's see what it does but i know what other quick languages there's two different tracks either you use the ita which ends up <unk> having like exclamation points in your words or you use like see hugh and act [noise] mhm yeah okay um this this language actually is one of the ones that uses c._q. an act [noise] mhm okay so the the the dental is he the the lateral is max and the <unk> is hugh which is the the normal sort of skiing court right mhm 'cause from what are you know what i'm saying it's certainly set it off africa it's standard in south africa [noise] now it's interesting it doesn't show for word medial clicks there doesn't have the uh same writing so i don't know if that means that they're just uh <unk> they're our phones or what does it just has to be square bracket and clinton uh i'd p._a. mm uh i don't know it's not necessarily mean i don't know i'm just focused on page nineteen the word for elephant is i'm [noise] <unk> <unk> the tough where it anyway [laughter] it sounded like elephant <unk> no [laughter] <unk> couldn't speak that's why i think they'd be thinking <unk> anyway so yes there are a number of complicated for logical process is in his language that has to do with [noise] um vowel merging in together um which leads to all sorts of tone chaos [noise] uh which also um shows up in certain kinds of grammatical patterns so that for example in possession you might get um a raft uh tone changes in the business or now um what kind of language do you think this is i'm trying to find out uh with you i don't see it like ah do you mean what kind of language in terms of <unk> of isolating um <unk> uh uh brain well <unk> inflicting it obviously has inflections yeah but i don't know if it's like a like a <unk> i would probably just call it straight forward synthetic it it it has occasionally the <unk> of um nation but so much chaos comes from the merging of morphine i wouldn't <unk> you know i would probably just call it synthetic mhm okay i was just curious as we were going on the sixers him into some ballet [noise] i mean it's kind of a mix well um it it i mean the fact that it has and inflection that is purely um tone and vow length and made relation mhm makes me think uh synthetic <unk> okay i'm just like um but i mean you can't use just one diagnostic but uh yeah pretty much synthetic to me um which is usually says right at the beginning so i was surprised that didn't really <unk> i don't know how anyone <unk> care [laughter] mm right are donating of summer institute of linguistics and they just want people to learn how to speak the language they can translate when i was into it i don't think they much care for oh it's <unk> i don't think it's interesting i say yeah i mean to some extent it's kind of there's a limit to the usefulness um when you're documenting a natural language mhm sitting down and saying oh what what type of logical categories is put into 'cause it's always a continuum anyway yeah true yeah i mean this this language <unk> send me a gluten mating mostly synthetic but you know there's a lot of languages where i mean english is mostly analytic except that it has a few um little <unk> that have grammatical purposes so you but i think when you're doing the field linguistics you're not bothering yourself with uh too much of the the <unk> stuff because you're just trying to document what the language does and then you let ah the egg heads back home trying to figure out what uh what category as it cuts into right [noise] um so dramatically see me the most fascinating thing about this language is the things that make it pronouns do [laughter] yeah i'm looking on there um and what i mean by this is first [noise] different pronoun sat and specifically pronoun clinics which [noise] excitement i'll get to know moment are used to in code things like it's the statement reality <unk> is it a command and all of that presented itself in a different set of selections for your <unk> [noise] the real fun thing and just starts on page one thirty five to explain it is there's this concept in the language of a subject focus marker weight am i on the right page now i've gone too far [noise] [noise] um where do you go is it is it reality affirmative yeah where'd you get what they do that on one thirty three ten <unk> yeah i can't type alright um you have these various clinics and to me the most fascinating thing about them is that they get repeated constantly on almost any constituents in the centre mhm so for example on page one thirty for example tics we have the english sentence and so i put my poisonous arrow completely well um the bow string [laughter] the marker for first person subject reality see occurs on every single element of the sentence [noise] except the very but at the very end one thirty four items six so attached to the conjunction and so i completely i my poisonous arrow hi well hi beau string hi [noise] [laughter] that's awesome internet awesome so and she talks a little bit i mean <unk> <unk> i'm giving an example of a little bit excessive but it's certainly not at all uncommon throughout the examples in the first time i read this grammar i was baffled abide by these morphine but they may occur multiple times mhm re affirming the same thing over and over and over again fortunately they're all small yeah um but they do show up an awful lot [noise] wow yeah so that's amazing to have just like everything in a second [noise] or i presume that <unk> that this is ah exceptional that it just had happened to have all the <unk> the clown most everything it yeah yeah yeah but the fact that you could have so many things be mark what the same inflection or a personal uh agreement is pretty bad at all right and these are included 'cause this is in addition to one overt mention of the full pronoun increase you missed it all over the place you miss it and and that's the thing that including the moon [laughter] well then right so it it's just wonderful and completely different from anything i've ever encountered before oh who wow [noise] [noise] right and then we have a separate forum for negatives yeah you know real is negative you have ah <unk> <unk> actually yeah real is positive and negative and then you're real positive and negative right where that is cool i like i like um i kind of like negative that are <unk> negative worms rather than negative articles just because [noise] fun to see that um she has a whole section on interactive with it broken down by word mhm um um what payment and starting your own one forty forty one yeah uh uh the first part of it and then [noise] and i've come to recognize this pattern as typical of grammar is produced by this summer institute of linguistics i think they have a template oh oh okay that does that make it was interesting but yeah it i think it's it's a useful breakdown i just like that how example rich the grandparents mhm interesting like uh you can get a whole bunch of stuff's decked out onto um the uh the <unk> uh <unk> i i guess that <unk> that you can get a whole bunch of stuff's back down to you any now and her her now and i guess now example are you looking at george uh well under who you had a meeting leveling number ah thirty five <unk> five oh they do they have a special <unk> ali a marker i loved that my [noise] [laughter] so um uh let let people know what what that particular would mean i mean and all chitter memory who work at a millionaire with uh right some some languages in addition to a normal thorough which just means <unk> more than one [noise] there is somebody would just have a two year old that means <unk> and everyone would <unk> so you could do like you know bob barker would mean bob and everyone was bob which you know my immediate family or his friends or do teasing and i was depending on the context [noise] there's this special section all for that it's an interesting idea huh well me also that they use a lot of uh abbreviations that if you're jumping around do you miss a <unk> an explanation as to go back and find like fishing for the first in <unk> ah yeah well they <unk> when you when you get right down the early in the yeah <unk> when you see <unk> ali er i i um well and i saw it i thought of papers with the the thing is uh you know bob jenkins p._h._d. at all right <unk> everybody else who who wrote this paper [noise] um i guess it's sort of in that vein um embarrassing to eat or go ahead no go oh you say <unk> language does not have very much reduced occasion at all oh it's okay yeah there are a few <unk> that are prone to redo placate when things happen to them you know and if something early on where it looks like oh well you know uh syllable was <unk> it it oh but it'd be too i'd have to go find that um yeah there's not much <unk> but you know this language is very very interesting um interesting you know how many so what's the excess because that's the those that'll take a look at things you know just <unk> i just got back from that page [laughter] it was an experience with my i have to go find that uh he's thirteen is where i'm sorry page tones are that way you talk about subject focus while i wasn't paying attention that's the ones where the morphine repeats multiple times yeah yeah he mentioned that that's what oh okay that that's what it is okay so like how many get subject focus that's craziness yeah um there's a uh an interesting section on subject focusing topic um i'm not exactly sure what it's saying but um [laughter] yeah i mean honestly i mean it has some <unk> some fun a logical processes it's kind of suffix thing you just post positions that are criticize um simple not crazy complex <unk> system you know you had your normal reciprocal reflects the dirt interested in cognitive that sort of <unk> [laughter] there's nothing about this language for the most part [noise] that is wild and crazy as you'd expect to be right we think click constant the language must be insane [noise] it's not necessarily the case um but that subject focus marker is truly wild and wonderful where's the sauna quite late yeah over the <unk> topic about just found her no damn sorry but uh it has <unk> interest stanley the uh the hearsay <unk> can be used to introduce direct speech or uh it's uh <unk> or <unk> i'm not sure what the tone markings mean here um and there it's a part of the cold but there are other um there are other bound more cream evidence <unk> interesting that it <unk> that there's a mixed there [noise] um oh they do have a personal agreement on honey it's sort of um <unk> the only <unk> object agreement morphine they mentioned that can be suffer the verb right huh uh benefactor doesn't mean it's interesting theoretical question if it's a clinic is it really the same kind of infection [noise] right we didn't have all that but rhetorical question rhetorical question um like many languages of africa it had special verb forms for secret thing uh-huh so you have if you have a complex series of action um you'll have a bunch of these <unk> that are in very spare morphological forms and finally the last one to get the the full apparatus oh agreements intense [noise] all of that the <unk> yeah [noise] i'm sorry bizarre coincidence the word for cow is whom blue though like it's like a reasonable cater almost no or what their whom boost sound like especially after you add <unk> [noise] i don't know found on buddy will get that [noise] all right i don't want to explain the joke anyway okay huh [laughter] a long <unk> grammar yeah there's a nice long tech um with a story about an hour and the <unk> the word for which i can't say oh it's like two of [laughter] [laughter] they're both age active or <unk> or <unk> huh [laughter] all right so we do not need <unk> hey i'm dave <unk> cool huh cool well uh-huh [laughter] yeah it's hard to get the glove was asian right price in a row um well i'd say if if any of our listeners speak some that way i'd love to hear some native speaker [laughter] <unk> story about the elevator [noise] [laughter] i'd love to i um i popular show greeting in this language or any quick language really yeah but <unk> no we're going to get mine [noise] mm anyway it reminds me of that yeah provided that uh the the the language would actually have it clicked in uh well except that either way but um i mean this language it seems like clicks are fairly common actually i don't know click are always common in a language ah yeah to me i thought it would they were surprisingly underrepresented mhm well really i yeah i don't know i mean well but the thing is [noise] plex or very hard i expect them not be like in every sentence [noise] they're hard for us <unk> i mean i don't i don't i i get suspicious of claims of efficiency and difficulty in is sort of abroad statements [noise] there are certainly some <unk> some language is where by the time you're an adult you have <unk> whatever [laughter] i was listening to how one i'm talking about nodule huh that's weird oh georgia <unk> forty properly continue you were talking about novels yeah right so for some of these especially quite sound languages the speakers um develop non jewels on their um vocal chords are vocal folds or whatever recalling him these days um but that mostly because they also have things like ethnic lotto pronunciations at some level [noise] i found it i think it <unk> that that do that problem but page i'll just put in i was searching some that way and it has it's other uh maybe an m._p. three files i don't know if they're actually samples or oh nerd list nice yeah i mean they're just worthless that's not as exciting as it could be but they are but it's their way files and and be three fall but i didn't want to risk having them blurt out uh well stuff into the recording <unk> gotta be good right is there anything else you want to say about sometimes <unk> other than every once you've gotta read the grammar 'cause it's cool [laughter] some light reading if you want to relax for bed yeah absolutely george yeah definitely read the grammer ah if i if um i'm going to listen to the um recordings later and see uh what exactly they are um [laughter] um [laughter] sorry but yeah it's a great little well what can i say about it it's a it's a great little thing to uh amuse yourself with and if you are interested in it all and making a quick language it's useful to have a natural example you have any idea how they actually work but it's still amazing to me that hey click language can actually have five different super sick mental on top of the <unk> oh my gosh i listen to some you to videos or quit languages and it's just it's mind boggling sometimes it's wonderful i love it yeah yeah great i've listened to people like senior and such and such and like it's amazes me because hurt hurt like all the cliques kind of sound the same to me once but now that i read this i'm like oh i went to learn how to pronounce all of them [noise] all of them that they're <unk> <unk> [laughter] all right are we ready for feedback i think so yes yes well you're just taking taking my moderate or pets for the for some reason [noise] so you know it'd be thirty drafted by the grammar oh how [laughter] how was your ankle [laughter] um my ankle is butter butter not completely healed yet um <unk> well not that [laughter] yeah um but let's actually get to feedback yes see back in that so that we can get on with done with the show um feedback just to reminder <unk> dot com is the email address to go to and that's the first place i go to to find <unk> we have gotten some some good email uh and you can also and um the uh they accomplished show greetings to that put breathing in the um in the uh subject and you can send ah site hitter images i've not been as good about getting those actually put up on the site but hopefully i i will get those uh fairly soon so it's uh i've gotten a couple of <unk> uh go to the contributed patron details on both of those things i just you know friendly reminder reminder every now and then so anyway we get it got an email again to <unk> dot com from a guy name calling himself liam w and he said hi there i uh makes me think of the dog from up anyway [laughter] hi i'm doug [laughter] oh my god [laughter] [laughter] i mean like <unk> uh i recently just discovered the pot tasks and i'm in la oh i've been toying with creating languages for my own r._p._g. and such fiction writing but never knew how deeply and completely the subject went anyway i started listening and one thing i quickly discovered is that my grass on grammar term is significantly lacking [noise] and i know the basics of every seventh grader should know i'm a bit older than that but so much of what i hear you just go goes way be on one i ever encountered even if i recall my undergrad english classes so my question is there or are there any books that you would recommend to someone who is meeting a boost a refreshing on general english grammar and especially advance grammar especially something that would be helpful for this so hot and would help as a basis for exploring then constructed languages <unk> present exploring constructed language i appreciate any suggestions thanks and thanks for <unk> cat the animal based sentence structure <unk> uh one cat blew me away uh liam energy mhm yeah yeah so uh we must be talking about the <unk> yeah um so mhm [noise] i guess describing more <unk> is the like the uh the <unk> bible but that's a little bit of <unk> uh a lot of linguistics one on one book so if you have any or if you look up um linguistics one on one i know i used to ah crude or perused a bookstore and just loved to flip through because they find terms for things and like oh so that's what i think it's called yeah i might also suggest the uh the language construction kit but partly because it specifically geared towards <unk> but it also has its <unk> also yeah it's also a good introduction into basic linguistics and and uh <unk> help to think about different different languages and different weight do think [noise] um but he's he's says undergrad english classes i would suggest also if you can fit it if you're in college right now and you can fit it into your schedule take linguistics one at one course oh awesome yeah i i'm guessing based on something he said that maybe he's not in college anymore mhm it might it might be yeah when you say i'm a bit older than that i'm guessing <unk> <unk> a little bit older than seventh grade [laughter] yeah <unk> people do not make it special effort to talk about how they're older than they used to be when they were in school and much they're getting approaching my age [laughter] okay so humane anyway in may not agree with uh george <unk> especially the book version of <unk> language construction kit mark rosenfeld her [noise] is i think a great combination ah training in <unk> and also an introduction to a lot of the terminology and explanations for things that might be new to you i didn't know that was oh sorry you didn't know there was a brittany <unk> no i didn't and it it's much ya <unk> compared to the online version of <unk> about twice as large <unk> also uh <unk> <unk> oh i mean <unk> i i um i hum nurse assistant clearly um uh blame myself for the book version cause i remember i specifically at whether he was going to put it on kendal [laughter] mhm it seems uh obvious for for him to do that um what was his he expanded a book ah or they didn't <unk> it it's amazing the problem is a refresher on english grammar or given advanced english grammar is not going to help you with complaining because it's only a chocolate english grammar and the joy of combining is it goes typically for most people hand in hand with the love of languages that are not much like english and we were just starting out i don't think we're just from a small number of people <unk> so yeah um i <unk> i would <unk> yeah i would i would definitely suggest you go into more general linguistics stuff because also a lot of sources that are on english grammar are going to talk a little bit in terms of like traditional grammar curves that yeah aren't necessarily going to apply in your language mhm um but uh oh that's a <unk> more on might tell you that you shouldn't use to pass the voice for example huh yeah yeah i actually um [noise] suggest well i mean even real linguists that are talking about english might talk about um [noise] things like i don't know the various mergers butter maimed afterwards or um like i bought mentioned long vowels understanding that english long vowels quote unquote or not actually long vowels um let me fine oh well you find something um i'm not gonna just mentioned one thing um that helped me is uh if you're interested in you have internet access to cruise on the <unk> i just uh [noise] there was a link for the index of linguistics articles and they're just alphabetically ordered something look interesting click it um you know i i've spent hours and hours and hours reminder flea wandering around um there's not mindlessly but very interestingly um looking on the internet for the things that are like wow that sounds cool er oh never heard of that before [noise] so yeah i actually some [noise] some of the articles on we keep <unk> it can be overwhelming i think for a beginner but even with that many of them are very good and these days i'm much more likely to have good explanatory material and example yeah i find much easier to work with interest explanations so we should say but we keep <unk> has good article on linguistics topics not as good articles on individual languages [laughter] some are okay a lot of them are are pretty good but a lot of them like almost all of them have a chronology but that's about it but but but that often the extent is like the phonology and a few interesting creatures but um he wants basic linguistics stuff and what <unk> is great for that you know if you hear the word or get it and you wanna look up <unk> you can go to <unk> and find the article [noise] uh i uh going back really quick to <unk> i actually um suggest <unk> edition but just because you may want to revert back and referencing a uh a actual book <unk> maybe cold is that it's easier to do than referencing at least <unk> yeah um yeah uh i was gonna oh oh boy you're talking about we can p._t. all going to say one of the first things i usually check it like if i hear something like tenuous i type <unk> brings out at least for an idea of like wanted pertaining to so i mean i don't i use with a <unk> great <unk> <unk> you know a lot huh mhm [noise] yeah and then there's nothing you can do to just sort of get yourself in the motive thinking about language <unk> is there a few really good linguistics long [noise] which talking about linguistics sometimes quite hard core but are still understanding that they have a non technical audience well i wouldn't say not technical but you have an educated but non linguistic audience mhm language log is my favorite and you can learn a lot about any books <unk> yeah you can learn a lot about english and other languages grammar [noise] i'm from reading they're probably uh overtime 'cause that <unk> language law you know if you are interested in english grammar language log is a good thing to uh learn learn from and they also talk about other languages quite a bit but it it's very very heavily english <unk> um there's some <unk> we have mister <unk> we have motivator grammar and um some of them like motivator grammar is mainly sort of an edge cheaper scripted this um thing so that sort of helpful but not as much as something like language law which also talked about linguistic <unk> more thoroughly um but yeah yeah i guess our <unk> is this the good online stuff but if you can find either basic introductory linguistics textbook if you happen to have access to college library that's fine but i really think like we said the language destruction <unk> ah print version [noise] um and give you a pretty darned good education to start with it oh like a basic <unk> um yeah <unk> which explains linguistics along the way oh well this has been changed <unk> like they they put things things are different [laughter] uh that was very descriptive ya huh but um yeah i was gonna say learning languages also good if you like to just learn to look and see <unk> sometimes [noise] <unk> might not include a lot of the term like are going to have her [noise] <unk> the terms linguistics you they're linguists use <unk> dissect language may not be used by teachers on line [noise] okay [noise] so are we ready to wrap this um yes i believe so [noise] all right [noise] william you have any final words of was [noise] nope not to speak [noise] my [noise] um i just say like [noise] you know your job you run wild and have fun [noise] listening to find one gay um [noise] and i'm going to say happy con line [noise] you have been listening to <unk> you can find the <unk> all previous episodes at <unk> dot com including links to our future <unk> online and a few resources you make sense of today's topic you're also find links to subscribe to a <unk> i do indoor throughout <unk> actors to our quarter face book and google plus pages kind a whole lot more questions commonsense to gestures may be sent to con liberia gee male dot com you can also submit those translated greetings we played the popular show <unk> hans <unk> display in our head or [noise] please c._d. contribute paid for details [noise] thanks for listening [noise] george <unk> sorry i was distracted [laughter] yes distracted by what uh someone is <unk> added me on uh google talk and i don't know how to block them [laughter] [laughter] okay we can edit that out [laughter] perfect irrelevant five thousand yeah [laughter] so um where where are you talking about this uh [laughter] we were just ending up were just saying it's magnificent and wonderful and i was talking about the papers mhm then i think yeah it definitely um hello hello [noise] hi [noise] hello now i can hear okay oh you better rested today [noise] not really [laughter] great yeah well my answer on uh i'm on my i found that i'm not home yet that's why i said i'd i'd message when i was home oh okay okay <unk> i'm sorry uh there was traffic on the road and we left usually takes about an hour but i'll be home shortly but cool okay sorry about that comes to lateral objective <unk> i forget [noise] and [noise] ah ah ah <unk> that sounds like a clinic [noise] ah [noise] well some people think that's where they start <unk> interesting example fourteen on page eighteen looks like what has a um <unk> click that's confusing oh mm wow <unk> [noise] i think you're switching someone that's hysterical [noise] huh [noise] [noise] [noise] jesus [laughter] have you gotten to the one that she's calling the one with the grunt yeah yeah to me it sounds kind of like <unk> <unk> <unk> no [noise] <unk> <unk> <unk> [noise] [laughter] that but the <unk> the the thing that got me that made me say oh jesus was that ah the woman the the example she uses for the voice click our in our like all of them are in plasters what's her i'm like [laughter] can occur in clusters [laughter] and what is this [laughter] it wasn't the how the heck am i supposed to do a click followed by l. sound [noise] oh my god and it's weird the ash paraded click [noise] oh we've lost that mike [noise] oh <unk> mike he's gone again huh we can't do an episode like this [noise] what my microphone is really quiet in three two one welcome to <unk> constructed languages and the people who create them i'm george quarterly uh over in wisconsin where you have william <unk> hello and up in new jersey we have my plenty [noise] we had my <unk> we still have michael m._p. no we have not

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  1. Conlangery Podcast
  2. Podcast
  3. conlang
  4. language
  5. linguistics
  6. reduplication
  7. Sandawe

Conlangery Podcast/Conlangery 54 Reduplication (last edited 2017-09-07 20:43:58 by TranscriBot)