Conlangery #67: Alũbetah

Conlangery #67: Alũbetah

Published: Mon, 17 Sep 2012 12:12:50 +0000 \

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Transcript

utterance-id1 we have come on now why are come on now my yeah we need <unk> to a gun on line i caught the cops i'll tell ya my back i saw <unk> tea <unk> seat tequila mark on me keep <unk> see talkie <unk> [noise] welcome to <unk> learn to people i'm george carlin [noise] uh [noise] with me in ah virginia right now is michael n. p. hello and we have a uh special gift that many ever you will know over in uh england we have bianca richard hello [noise] so you guys know be <unk> uh like i said before williams taking a break and ah [noise] the other person that i was planning on ah getting on the show uh as a replacement is not available for this week so we are to gracious leave step in to uh talk about a ah hey <unk> how how things been going for your bianca actually much going on [noise] got a house no scan now like you know getting a job <unk> oh okay yeah i think i have <unk> you have to practice driving on the other side of the road then i suppose [laughter] last election [noise] yeah [noise] i don't know do they do they have any different requirements or is it <unk> well i don't know what the climate well see you but <unk> test rather than just very like targeted for <unk> [laughter] i think might driving like took me now more than twenty so [laughter] i've been told him that more serious mhm mm i wonder if you have to learn to uh <unk> there's a lotta people drive stick shift <unk> not really an issue well what do you have to do it on the other side [noise] i don't see why that would matter [noise] ah <unk> i don't know it's like oh i i can tell a story about that uh you mean like getting <unk> and it's like right yeh shifting with your left hand and everything [noise] but yeah there's a story about that but i don't the the labor that point anyway it's not linguistically linguistic enough for it now but we have uh this is what fifty seven right an odd number episode and <unk> yeah that means that yes sixty seven sorry i i could see it confused sometimes [noise] and uh so today we have a con line episode for you guys uh were featuring uh uh <unk> uh a new but but <unk> other than me but uh yeah and i was trying to get breath your voice on the ah ah but yeah i <unk> i knew but [noise] yeah it's it's a little hard but uh [noise] 'cause <unk> few people use uh <unk> voice so we need the so <unk> that was actually one of <unk> <unk> and one of your <unk> so many <unk> <unk> <unk> yeah it's pretty uncommon i don't actually kinda like the way it stuck <unk> i mean it's like just going to go and start talking about it and when i first things i notice pretty small sony mendocino <unk> [noise] and [noise] which is up with a prank shows and testing <unk> stuff which will get you later but i guess notice that the <unk> which cheap protection h. or <unk> or whatever you wanna call it you don't think it's affected us um doesn't actually have any set for an ethical idle fuck it is it's really that come out as [noise] yeah at least i haven't found it anyway i like that [noise] you know there's a lot of them are there's a lot about but the olive phoney and and send the the [noise] seems a little bit [noise] weird um <unk> in particular like you mentioned even um you can distinguish based on just where the syllable structure is which [noise] i don't know if that ever heard if something like that ever occurred i don't know if anyone that would ever analyze it that way but um so you mean the fact that it like <unk> what it has other line as [noise] uh t. if i <unk> i <unk> i think that i have one that like <unk> <unk> <unk> [noise] but i could be wrong [noise] [noise] mm i guess it could occur i mean it's sort of um like for a net lying to have that you wouldn't have to actually have it be the only way you could possibly um the only way that you could possibly ah and a lot of the the ah centre right [noise] <unk> no the the ah phonology right sorry um little life or no [noise] but yeah i mean it wouldn't have had a <unk> and update <unk> because you know why they stretch eh or the <unk> the a change so yeah yeah [noise] i guess i guess it's it's possible plausible them it's just uh [noise] there's so many different rules here yeah yeah but like he even says that you know because of the way the rules or he uses a more of a fanatic transcription they're still <unk> [noise] yeah they're still a few places where he doesn't make distinctions like he does it in his transcription he his his uh romano's transcription he doesn't distinguish between voiced invoice list nasal but in other in everywhere else [noise] virtually everywhere else he's distinguishing uh phones our phones rather than phonemes because [noise] it just works better that way and um [noise] so when you read stuff you read the the surface more and you know it is one of those cases where that seems to be the the uh easier way to do things [noise] [noise] yeah i mean because it <unk> i think [noise] [noise] i don't know what that fish away on how much you include it sunny messy just wanting food that you know and kind of <unk> at the mental found in the language or if you want to include the contract it sounds [noise] <unk> <unk> quite a bit like <unk> but he seems to only go with the mental contests [noise] yeah <unk> that's the way i feel fine thank you [laughter] [noise] that's that's an interesting question right because in a human language we can't necessarily figure out what the underlying the all the underlying forms are [noise] but in this case what they call on line you can just decide <unk> what the underlying forms are without respect to existing um minimal pairs or anything like that if you had a linguist uh analyzing just we're just uh transcribe words with no input from this grammar [noise] they might come up with an entirely different system and i really wish we had the uh offer this language on for this kind of discussion but uh i wasn't able to contact that person so uh but it is a very interesting and this part of it may stem from this is a pro pro toe language [noise] is is what he said it's the predator language of it's the ancestor of a protester language that that the author is using for um a a language family project they're they're building so i wonder if that means <unk> <unk> if i get <unk> something which takes out public <unk> stuff going on or [noise] uh i'm i'm at all so i swim i like them i'm sorry go on ah go right oh i was gonna say um if this is something of you know former smoker spoken that might you know kind of a <unk> um why maybe i was just an underlying or um uh an <unk> an inventory whereas you know the actual sound that there are in terms of what's <unk> are a lot greater [noise] mhm i think cats are a lot quite <unk> quite quite a bit going on [noise] [noise] oh like maybe heart with all the sounds about this like our phone concluded maybe he was like plugging in the like the first five hundred years of his found changes <unk> that's actually it's a <unk> actually a bit much for even five hundred years or a thousand years but [noise] 'cause this is a lot of um [noise] <unk> [noise] i guess not much for a <unk> for five hundred but um [noise] so but uh and those are my made up numbers he didn't he didn't say he doesn't say anything here about how long ago this was broken or anything i was just speculating [noise] but um so what else was interesting other than the crazy phonology that i really do suggest people take a look at it 'cause it has some interesting ideas ah about um uh what happens when two aspirin come together uh what happens when i spirits and other sounds come together those are those are interesting interactions that he has in there um [noise] things uh with um <unk> <unk> there's also the weird rule where uh <unk> and turns to l. and then <unk> [noise] yeah but um [noise] that that all that is very interesting stuff to uh to uh talk about but moving along there's [noise] so he has [noise] [noise] [noise] i see that [noise] [noise] [noise] [noise] actually <unk> <unk> like <unk> or whatever [noise] like i gave the case in later on like <unk> <unk> thing [noise] but <unk> but <unk> <unk> i play being at math but it's actually nice [noise] [noise] yeah well um yeah he uses <unk> for ah progressive aspect [noise] um there's <unk> animals too and i kind of like my <unk> my <unk> fatty so [noise] yeah [noise] emphatic <unk> word but <unk> but he's not here yeah <unk> well not [laughter] that would be weird [noise] um that could but actually wouldn't be weird but he doesn't matter but [noise] um so he has there's a negative we're that's an that's an interesting ain't like that that would be a real language <unk> i'm like well yeah i don't know anything about thanks [laughter] if i do know something just floating out and then they'll come to me when i'm walking down the street and i look at uh bush and like <unk> when i was thinking that guy [noise] [laughter] [laughter] like um like negative ion yeah so instead of a <unk> or <unk> he had and i said i'm going on a date wack <unk> she is tammy <unk> negative <unk> it does but it skipped it down if i had that means headache like now that location or oh yeah interesting kind of like [noise] big emphasize more it's not that not being there rather than than the non existence of it [noise] mhm [noise] it it is not versus is not there yeah but those are bad but english example because the first one that dramatic but anyway [noise] um [noise] [noise] that's an interesting thing to explore like why can't we say it does not uh not accepted <unk> except isn't <unk> question with unemployment if he's a it is not then it kind of leaves listener wondering you know it is not what but i got out it's simply you know you can't he is he has to go with something like that's <unk> yeah right yeah it is in a state of non existent yeah [noise] but anyway that's a little english <unk> whole let's pull back to uh what we're talking about here um there's <unk> normally monitor fires but er sort of like the <unk> <unk> it looks like what it is is basically stayed of or am i wrong in medicine well i mean it looks like a kind of but i think if it's for example he never it doesn't really say um what they're like for example beautiful women he says when it comes from <unk> i'm sure if that thing like it's a woman and then there's actually a tribute particle for beautiful but that's attached on two <unk> two or how that goes but it it's kind of like um <unk> can be data verbs or [noise] you know attribute is um crazy so to speak [noise] he did actually uh use those to derive the um where is it now he drives the um uh sort of some things like a relative claws from that [noise] he calls it a model for her claws <unk> basically like a relative claws one um in the mail to cause um does it have to be in different sentence of it's the subject i think [noise] <unk> not down in the syntax area i think it was talking about the freebies order uh refunding [noise] oh i do uh [noise] so yeah i did not um he says er for subject some clauses he says that causes can i [noise] the subject instead the construction has been coated in discourse using a third person critical subject so for example um you know you would yeah cool [noise] period that was not good [noise] so i'm assuming that <unk> i'm sorry yeah well but at the <unk> yeah definitely the closets off of um being a subject which is not <unk> which is not what the marta far claws are doing the modified clauses are basically a relative quote modify now so [noise] but <unk> <unk> what's going on now [noise] yeah [noise] [noise] <unk> <unk> any sort of agreement with the subject <unk> <unk> conjugate it's how [noise] yeah the one thing about this language is but uh [noise] some of the explanations or a little bit <unk> it's just the um giant list of things [noise] and there's not so much losses so that's all presentation issues [noise] there's not <unk> examples was translation <unk> um uh under more <unk> agree with their constituents <unk> with the with the amount of <unk> [noise] so now they don't have <unk> yeah um those are the engine that amount of transit of though but pretty strict word how someone tell me what's going on with these pronouns [noise] oh um you know obviously there's three pronouns his first second third person and then i guess if you want be horrible [laughter] of them you just <unk> attached to click on to them um and then you know the <unk> but moving on from there i guess we'll just written there um it looks like there's different forums or if there's if it's used before so constant <unk> or other cases what do you think george um [noise] [noise] oh okay yeah the <unk> ah virtually anything that he has <unk> has like two forms one for um before vow and one for before <unk> so yeah and it's just it's just one of those uh things [noise] and that makes sense [noise] with a lot of his um oh a funny stuff you could think of it as those <unk> those maybe started out free and then got dumped on and uh <unk> as a result of fun logical processes they were uh oh the uh oh it's actually a little bit more complex and is used for but the other thing is that his pronoun pro clinics in in politics are listed for <unk> so you'd have to attach those and then runs through all the uh phone logical process was to see what they actually current into um gets confusing let's like examples 'cause he doesn't give you that [noise] <unk> yeah um yeah well um under the verb phrased that he talks about conan included <unk> to a <unk> of the <unk> subject indoor as an including the kids with object so they gave us um oh example there ever and then example that they're over with a <unk> i then within a direct opposite than the whole <unk> i eat it um any one show you so's <unk> where is it yeah i'm about one <unk> um right after where he talks about prep additional pronouns uh [noise] uh um yeah i think so this <unk> this there's just a few issues with uh where he put things and how this is organize 'cause this is [noise] um what we're looking at is a web page grammar that it's kind of <unk> in some ways he may have been sort of writing down notes <unk> and uh [noise] i mean there's some <unk> there's there's structured too but there's places where yeah like <unk> not all the information on pronounced one in one place [noise] um so and proposition of pronouns or another interesting thing um i guess it's it's just the the <unk> the the repetitions or [noise] uh <unk> right and then he attaches be included uh onto those to make a free spending form <unk> is <unk> on me and uh on you and uh on him her in it and uh so those are similar to spanish continual but or uh i was gay look actually has <unk> <unk> a position and it shows like <unk> <unk> <unk> i got a guy i guess i i'm on my um [noise] oh yeah similar similar to that except the um those are um i think these are a little bit just sort of specific to purchase <unk> [noise] to places where you <unk> [noise] uh i'm not i think the <unk> language is actually have some agreement sometimes on that uh don't quote me on that because there may be completely line [noise] um [noise] it's interesting i mean to see how different the actual service from is from you know where it will derived from i mean i know later on it shows um <unk> really well but uh where are you <unk> explaining what happened with say conjugation or pronouns i'd really love to see <unk> um kind of underlying lay out of it not just <unk> <unk> working boundaries and that kind of thing i'd like to see if she gave <unk> actually did like step by step planning on a logical process going on mhm <unk> [noise] thank you he look at times <unk> i would not <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> yeah well i'm nuts but comes from him having so many different process was working on the [noise] and for some interesting uh surfers forum deriving the the sort of uh regular irregularity but ah i've talked about on the you know before [noise] mhm i was going to see i was like fourteen different uh sunday rules and they're all quite quite prevalent so um mm like every single rule i see well i i would it looks like maybe two thirds of them are used in any one word um you know that's just a quick at the moment but they're a lot of change that go on um in the words are not that long so you know oh three changes do are the three letters long they make it a totally different looking word [noise] one thing that i like is that even though his <unk> pretty much fanatic uh he added the phony make transistor transcription on all of his example so that you can actually read where these things come from and then you can see how it's not really your regular it's just fun logical processes screwing with the the surfers form yeah it helps to see how like [noise] it <unk> it cash and how they change like i'm not saying that <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> you know and <unk> and now hey aspiration [noise] that that nasal kept getting married in april i i'm not going to call them <unk> <unk> and then and al <unk> and then in l._a. again mhm [noise] <unk> yeah maybe we should feature some the ah some time down the road maybe we should you should look at the descended language for this because i think [noise] um this language may be sets things uh to uh may <unk> his you know <unk> complicated and then [noise] open up a wide variety of directions for ah daughter languages because you could have some loose certain forms or only use uh certain form or things like that [noise] um have irregularities developed through analogies and all that kind of [noise] um so the green uh i well i p._a. transcripts ones are the underlying <unk> yeah right yeah that's really the underlying <unk> forum and that includes <unk> boundaries and uh stress because that's important [noise] um so you can you can look at stuff like uh <unk> no <unk> <unk> <unk> no four well <unk> more drastic i'll i'll non they become oh <unk> uh all around [noise] don't make me say that again uh there's uh a lot of stuff going on [noise] and he does have a <unk> a size <unk> text but is cost within our linear so you can take a look at that if you want to look at how things break down [noise] i really there's so much about this language that kind of <unk> and again i really wish i could have gotten in contact with um the ah the creator but the only email i found got bounced um [noise] but the i think it's a very interesting thing to read through on if you want to get some ideas for fun logical processes and such [noise] i don't know how many people would really want to go as crazy as this but it's a very interesting sort of experiment in <unk> west key uh fun logical process is leading to really crazy form surface warm [noise] yeah i think that um sometimes the psychological process was that you know wouldn't be laid on until the very end kind of model the water's when you're trying to figure out what's going on in reality because when you're trying to read through conjugation you have to almost think okay well this this is what it was <unk> surf form is what's happening i mean oh yeah [laughter] it's a bit of a <unk> i mean are there but i mean it's it's you know a lot of good interesting things happening but there's you know there's there's real languages that have crazy crazy front on with foreign logical processes but make or to understand what's going on from surfers form so that's not an unusual thing necessarily [noise] this is a pretty high in the the sort of the the difference between the the underlying in the surf <unk> <unk> it's it just makes things interesting i sorry yes makes things more interesting [noise] um [noise] <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> uh-huh [noise] yeah that's ah another thing she was able to so we've talked on the show about how you can take a small inventory and using fun logical processors and fun uh tactics do a whole lot of different things and this is an example of not so much with [noise] fun attack but with with heavy uh fun logical processes this guy has uh created something very uh unique very interesting from a small underlying funny mandatory [noise] um i think um it's interesting he put in there uh <unk> the <unk> the online has um <unk> <unk> uh <unk> and <unk> and that really helps if you have um you know generating your dictionary if you have a certain <unk> you know a certain amount of words and you want to create a different words from those it's nice to show how you can nonetheless something or making more propositions from those that small <unk> ah yeah [noise] <unk> yeah it's very um [noise] it is a very interesting i don't it's [noise] seems a little odd to me that he has a hey productive process for producing uh <unk> positions but i guess that's just my english brain objecting 'cause ah well i don't know english makes new propositions all the time i don't know what to uh what what makes me think it's odd but for some reason i [noise] i think of it is odd i think of um i think of closed class had positions more common even though english is not really that way either but um i don't think so to open i think it's a closed class but there are ways to derive probably two things that closed class um using those <unk> oh well yeah <unk> it's sort of it looks like a [noise] a lot of <unk> adding uh adding <unk> positions in it [noise] some of it's adding ah prep resistance together so and we have stuff like that so behind is uh you can from behind is [noise] [noise] the the aspirin pay i think yeah <unk> no is that girl i've somehow no uh and the the wire cases isolation is not possible will tell the difference between complex proposition plus now [noise] and the simple proposition plus compound um mm okay complex propositions like free standing foreign logical room unit okay oh one now can be turned into a proposition by attaching one of the [noise] now i understand okay [noise] so [noise] yeah he <unk> he only has like three <unk> three yeah <unk> they [noise] [noise] well so usually means behind and formed by adding the proposition ah and meaning on honor at too and now <unk> eat me back and then the from behind uses huh which is from so that's what it is is <unk> that's [noise] scene but okay i am completely stupid that's there's nothing strange that [laughter] that's perfectly understandable um [noise] uh above no that's interesting above is uh the proposition on plus the verb to fly or however [noise] [noise] so uh <unk> instead of having it be like <unk> or anything it's it's uh <unk> fly is above that's a that's an interesting way to her of that um [noise] so did you guys get in too much [noise] like <unk> so i see that word order [noise] um [noise] [noise] <unk> getting <unk> and <unk> i kinda follow samples [noise] <unk> [noise] and it was ah you <unk> it looks like <unk> or <unk> it looks like <unk> tend to be towards yeah makes sense and uh you so you can <unk> the object moving into the front or you can di <unk> subject moving it back um and there is a uh thursday passive <unk> voice but it works um odd way you you just sort of switches places one thing that you know <unk> <unk> one thing that makes it a little tough to figure out what <unk> what um no ethics is er being as to what is that the sunday occurs and that and it's written as it's broken and so i don't i'm not sure if this is seems almost like um there's a lot of medication and it was like leaving it is but they're all you know put together and in the service for <unk> and it doesn't really necessarily <unk> looked like it uh um a word with the functional ah <unk> <unk> <unk> it's it's in a gluten of language for the most part but um look [noise] uh but ends up looking fusion all on the surface [noise] because of the way things change um yeah oh this is interesting is uh accounting numbers so five is drive from hand and he gets um and then from six to nine we get uh we get a hand in one hand to hand in <unk> smart like one hand in hand well yeah well one hand but basically that makes that [noise] that um that uh common strategy that we've we've talked about or in uh our ah numerals episode but uh it's interesting to see <unk> but in action [noise] uh it might be slightly more interesting if he made it irregular so that like [noise] six seven and eight we're form that way <unk> nine randomly had its own route [noise] uh nice to see it again this is very clear [laughter] on again this is a <unk> so it may be that he put that in so that he could have the the senate languages shoes [noise] one or another uh two half or not have or something like that [noise] uh derive other words from borrowing from something else so again wish i could ask discussing question but i wasn't able to get hold of it [noise] um yeah i mean there's a lot more stuff on here but uh we've been talking for quite a bit already so i don't know is there anything you guys have burning to be said mm not really [noise] she has she doesn't have a <unk> <unk> [noise] <unk> <unk> <unk> like <unk> dog [noise] or something at max demand and dallas [noise] i saw another thing there were um they're with expressions of something being with uh he said something about if something is sort of subordinate in some way with one if one element is subordinate in one way uh to another in a uh committed <unk> structure hey with b. he uses a on be instead of a would be yeah mm yeah which is an interesting distinction to make i'm not exactly like i i i'd have to be some more examples to see exactly how that is working um here we go to express that uh thing person and the other thing person function together as a single constituent but the second second is somehow magically subordinate to the first the proposition eh on at his views and attaches to the second <unk> phrased to form a purple additional phrase so an example is a man with his dog uh how <unk> yeah uh <unk> who who um but um so he's using and instead of what is the uh pro position or with um [noise] uh but um [noise] i guess [noise] and this is a question i would ask is i guess maybe the dog is ah the dog belongs to the man so that's that's why it's um subordinate in that way uh but i'm not sure if it marked for position or anything oh well um so another um interesting thing i was uh [noise] see here is kurt comparison um mm he uses the propositions so say the man is bigger than the woman is literally the man is big on the woman or she's prettier than he is he is pretty on him [noise] <unk> ah an interesting usage of that and it's you know [laughter] <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> <unk> and like if she want to say i will be like ah my <unk> but they're all <unk> like any out that girl <unk> handle it okay [laughter] i think <unk> <unk> i <unk> um [noise] i think she got <unk> if i like hockey and like you get <unk> [noise] [noise] huh oh that's interesting uh like you were mad has a dog <unk> man would be a <unk> [noise] [noise] [noise] [laughter] amanda [noise] uh on the that's the seventies so um yeah i think really um it's just that people look through this this uh document and take what what you will from it uh i understand there's some stuff that's not fully explain but um you can probably use it to generate ideas for yourself and definitely look through the uh the fun logical processes section 'cause it's a very good way uh um [noise] of figuring out how to um how to generate some irregular looking surface forums out of a regular uh language um the the and the uh the vocabulary at the end is sort of the medically well it's by part of speech but it's arranged but um [noise] there's some interesting things there i noticed um <unk> it's actually in the grammar but he has fairly realistic um small <unk> uh basic colored term [noise] there's only four of them um and they it looks like he sort of um did what you probably should do for a a naturalistic language and uh look at the <unk> of uh of colored <unk> stage figured out from there [noise] um [noise] he has a few things that are um interesting in terms of semantic range rather than the color um but they're not um but it's not it's not a huge leap detailed dictionary and again provo perimeter language you don't i don't think he really needed to be hugely detail in the <unk> if he was talking about something that he was more interested in using in the uh for substantial work right if he was talking about some of the darker languages i would expect some of those [noise] more complex meanings too developed than him didn't need a more ah a more flushed out dictionary so anyway uh anything anything else that like burning in your mind or can we move on to some ah feedback [noise] yeah i think that's taken care of all the burning <unk> burning point [noise] [noise] [laughter] [noise] so we have uh aaron rights and hi guys greetings from melbourne australia loving the <unk> keep up the good work what am i discovered it a few weeks ago but have worked my way back through most of your beckham <unk> [noise] [laughter] why adequate eyes in which you might have covered in europe sooner on learn words but i'm not sure i'm a high school language teacher german french and chinese [noise] and when i was talking to one class but <unk> between languages we got off on on a tangent about <unk> [noise] for example near our school was a water way cold <unk> creek <unk> indigenous australian language more room i'm probably <unk> but that was that was spoken in this area before european settlement the word <unk> means creeks and the english name is essentially more decree creek answer her uh is also an english version of the arabic world for desert and he mentioned <unk> river <unk> home river uh some others i know it happens in numerous other contact [noise] our question is whether there's an actual word for this phenomenon or is it just when <unk> <unk> <unk> um i believe the term for this is <unk> right i went on now and again the capital of it um [noise] what is that example um my old roommate got at night i eat <unk> k. k. k. yeah yeah but the does the word <unk> comes from washing or well try is probably alert whatever language but the the word came from try it probably means t. actually because uh the the the the chinese <unk> become the word for t._v. in so many different languages and then the other one is hey which i'm not sure where it comes from but um [noise] what what i was saying is um [noise] so the the <unk> creek is a good example also it's more <unk> creek in this australian language but so that's a like a compound up to work [noise] but i think in england mhm yeah but in english we reanalyze that as a single morphine <unk> and people added <unk> to uh this this happens we mentioned <unk> on on the load and word episode that like grammatical things <unk> bombed on this way like all the uh learn words from arabic that have all at the beginning which is um uh an article and arabic uh yeah so it's and it's it's not [noise] redundant per se it's just that basically when we borrowed the term we didn't know what it meant and we change the the internal structure of it in some cases or in case of <unk> we just we just uh changed the meaning from desert to to uh the name of this particular desert i i just thought of another example that's like um <unk> no the city los angeles well their baseball team or the angels so if you say the los angeles angel then that translates needles to the uh the angel angels yeah yeah a lotta people a lot of people have have but i think ninety one front around [laughter] [noise] um as far as <unk> goes i was looking at <unk> um i think that's also where where are you basically reanalyze where the boundary as for <unk> um the morphine like hamburger and went <unk> missed it was and realizing correctly of hamburger and then you switch hamper cheese yeah and i couldn't chances are that way too yeah yeah [noise] yeah <unk> yeah [laughter] yeah um this might be some kind of ran out this where the people didn't speak than the native language and figured that word for creek yellow [noise] was part of the <unk> [noise] and it doesn't have to happen with uh you you mentioned a couple of examples with uh native words so that you know it's it's not about learn words obviously chocolate derives and alcohol both private ultimately from them words but i mean it can it happens with fairly native eyes english terms and [noise] it can also happened uh the the thing that a lot of people talk about is ah acronyms or initial <unk> getting reanalyze so [noise] ah people will say a. t. m. machine [laughter] you know a a <unk> or pin number [noise] uh [noise] again they're re analyzing the uh so that in their minds a._t._m. is not automatic tell her machine it's the a._t._m. and a._t._m. means this particular type of machine so that can attach machine on the end of it [noise] ah more pin number is not personal identification number it's just pin and so they can say number on it [noise] ah it's just um so that's what we what i would call it is <unk> uh basically uh either uh bar wearing something and borrowing it with a different meaning than the original which is really common actually lot of languages will do that or um messing up the or um miss analyzing the internal structure or just not knowing the internal structure and taking it as a single morphine uh so i think <unk> [noise] yeah so it's not redundant in english [noise] to say the bottom line is it's not redundant and english because in english it's not <unk> it's more <unk> is the name so [noise] anyway um i think it'd be redundant you understood both languages but that it that you know a speaker of english would've known that eloquence creek um you could say the the <unk> uh you know for us and it doesn't necessarily mean that they're <unk> trusting a name or meaning um you just <unk> earlier <unk> there's a term for creak as part of the name um yeah with our <unk> the <unk> the the uh native language uh <unk> uh [noise] is the word for language so somewhere said he <unk> language or got anything the language language but still that kind of <unk> if you don't speak both languages you may not know what that where does it get yeah [noise] uh i i i love like freaked out when you said <unk> [laughter] sorry about that uh <unk> uh but anyway yeah that's true and i think of how many languages are just the word for language like people [noise] [noise] yeah [laughter] oh are they uh <unk> <unk> in new it means people and not know that i mean that happens all the time but yeah yeah i mean i'm not going to know like in a while you know some <unk> surely [noise] mhm [laughter] um but yeah i think um but uh it's it's uh an interesting thing that happens it's just it just goes to show when people are i think the main thing to think about especially thinking about uh this in in terms of <unk> is [noise] when words are borrowed between languages or wind languages come into contact people don't have complete information about the other language and people don't even have complete information about everything in their own language which is what is part of what drives linguistics changes that different people learn things differently [noise] so you know it's it's a very interesting interesting you know things to be thinking about sort of [noise] if you're putting sort of learn words and stuff into your online too [noise] [noise] or complex [noise] uh or complex [noise] um <unk> <unk> things like initial <unk> and stuff complex abbreviation structure and some [noise] a complex morphology that can end up being reanalyze [noise] so i think that's enough discussion on that but uh i think yeah any objections to wrapping up the show now i think we're the <unk> well on it [noise] <unk> [noise] [noise] all right then uh i'm going to start since you haven't been on for such a long time <unk> do you have any final words wisdom in now i will never have <unk> i can't believe you [laughter] [laughter] oh okay my um [noise] there was always surprised new things um you know take a look at other people come lines of comedy will have some interesting things you can look that demonstration from um so yeah to [noise] be awesome and <unk> yeah [laughter] very wise words [noise] hopefully our our our uh mech person coming uh will be better at finding i'm working with [laughter] i could try to find quote during the week for with with them but it may or may not be related common [noise] [laughter] uh doesn't have to be anyway i'm getting a before that got conversations the rail i'm gonna say have been gone [noise] thank you for listening to con language you can find our our cars and <unk> dot com you can send questions comments more topics were featured language suggested to conway angry i see male dot com [noise] to submit icon langhorn that line greedy for the top of the show see our contributed paid for detail [noise] <unk> provided by these language creation society <unk> music is by no device [noise] okay um my bianca bianca my major's alley now you can [noise] and <unk> they don't have where they act like some people think it's because people complain about it all the time but they have like anti wednesday night she had the guys are trained for like five seconds and then stopped and i like it was such a crap day it rained in on like <unk> what do you think of ah wisconsin wisconsin's a great um at least madison is great i haven't ah been many other places i can get really good cheese their stuff if you go to like supermarkets here there's there's cheeses veteran labelled as wisconsin cheese ah um [noise] or like local farmer stuff whatever um it's it's hilarious when i first got here like like the day after i arrived i went and i found a supermarket and it was like i was in the cartoon version of wisconsin because there was actually a section there was a big sign that said cheese and like there's a guy around whose job it is presumably to wander around and help random <unk> wonder in <unk> to select cheeses [laughter] oh what a glamorous job well look at it on your resume i was a cheese at first i have the cheese um like you know the guy <unk> getting child actually she <unk> does that mean eating lots of cheese [laughter] awesome it's amazing i love to cook she's an ice cream <unk> who was i <unk> i think he's just an hourly grocery store employee but he was in a fancy uniform and he knew enough about the cheeses so [laughter] i know <unk> [noise] <unk> [noise] a connoisseur of cheese or perhaps the kind of [noise] <unk> [noise] a p._a._c. but i get chicken <unk> again yang <unk> we have a show to do [noise] uh [laughter] have you know we're already making a bunch of notes so

Tags

  1. Conlangery Podcast
  2. Podcast
  3. Alũbetah
  4. conlang
  5. language
  6. linguistics

Conlangery Podcast/Conlangery 67 Alũbetah (last edited 2017-09-08 08:44:06 by TranscriBot)